+188 Homosexuality isn't a choice, amirite?

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Whoah, controversy. I didn't ask to be bi. I'm christian. I didn't want to be. I still have to deal with it.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

If you're gonna bring up controversial topics on amirite, at least phrase them cleverly or something, haha. You kinda laid it on a little thick. Not that I'm disagreeing with you. ;D

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Wrong. People don't have a choice in whether or not they are born with homosexual propensities. People DO have a choice in whether or not they want to serve their own desires over what God says is right. It's a different struggle for everyone. It's the same deal with any other sin people are born with a leaning towards. You just have to decide that serving God and obeying Him is more important than fulfilling your physical desires.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

did you just say homosexuality is a sin?

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Yep. Romans 1:25 in God's Word says that homosexuality is wrong. So, yes.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

God says a lot of things are wrong. People still do them. Everyone can ultimately be forgiven though.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Just because we're forgiven doesn't mean we shouldn't do our best not to sin. People living in a homosexual lifestyle are constantly choosing to repeat the same sin of giving into their desires. Yes, we all do it. It doesn't make any sin worse or not.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

You realize God didn't make the Bible? The people who wrote it are saying it's wrong. Sucks for you.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

God inspired the Bible. The Holy Spirit filled His prophets, and they wrote down His words. So, in essence, the Bible was indeed written by God.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Or by a bunch of drunks who heard a voice and created the religion? Ha, that's a good one. Anyone ever stop to think that all of God's people who talked to him were imagining it because they were drunk? Lmao, I love myself for that

by Anonymous 14 years ago

You are using religious scripture to justify an irrational hatred of homosexuals. Prove me wrong, give me a rational reason to dislike homosexuals. Remember, quoting scripture is not the same as making a valid point.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Actually, I'm not. I don't hate homosexuals, as you have assumed. Nowhere did I say that, so it would lead me to believe that you are ignorantly copying and pasting the same argument you use with everyone, without thinking through an intelligent response. Believing that a certain behavior is a sin does not mean that I hate the person who does it. I believe murder is wrong, but that doesn't mean that I hate and condemn all murderers. People I love sin constantly, as do I, but I don't hate them because I believe what they are doing is wrong. I simply believe that it is indeed sinful and wrong to do whatever it is they are doing.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

And also: I don't quote Scripture to make a point, I quote Scripture to back up the point I am making. The Bible is the Word of God (2 Timothy 3:16: "All Scripture is inspired by God and is useful to teach us what is true and to make us realize what is wrong in our lives."), and so it is a solid reference for what is right and what is wrong. The Bible has also never in any way been historically disproved, just a side note.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

You said above that homosexuals "just have to decide that serving God and obeying Him is more important than fulfilling [their] physical desires", that shows a disrespect towards homosexuals, do they not love people for emotional reasons too? Rhetorical question. Of course they do. You're saying that homosexuals should repress what they feel to be their true nature in order to obey God. Some poor gay kid might be told that and decide to repress their love and instead seek companionship in a relationship they do not want. Should they be denied love and happiness by you? Should their partner (who they don't really want sexually anyway) suffer because of you and your beliefs? I think not. "I don't quote Scripture to make a point" Really? 'Cause this looks a lot like you making an unfounded assertion and then backing it up from your scripture. "The Bible is the Word of God (2 Timothy 3:16: "blah blah blah")" Keep readin, punk

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Besides, I said that you were using scripture in place of thought, not as a reference. You have failed to give a reason other than that homosexuality is a sin, according to a bunch of long dead fools, for homosexuals to reject a homosexual lifestyle. Disregard your scripture for a moment and attempt to find a single logical reason why homosexuals should pursue a heterosexual lifestyle. "so it would lead me to believe that you are ignorantly copying and pasting the same argument you use with everyone, without thinking through an intelligent response." Oh! The irony. No, it is not I who is failing to think but you. I have thought logically and independently on what views to form on this subject, as I do on all subjects. I do not need the teachings of ancient people to tell me what to think. Instead I use methods of logic to find my own answers. Not done yet...

by Anonymous 14 years ago

This deserves to be stated clearly: by simply quoting the bible, by taking its teachings as your beliefs on topics you are relegating yourself to intellectual poverty. Views based solely on unfounded biblical teachings are not worth a damn. I only have one more thing to say, making comments like this: "People are born with a propensity toward homosexual behavior, as I have said before. The choice they make is whether or not to give in." and assuming that you're right on issues you have no understanding or experience of is just plain annoying. Actually, one more thing, reply to my friend down-thread with the other long thread. Also see that friend's posts for occasions when the bible has been proven historically inaccurate.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

The Bible says alot of things that don't make much sense...like beating women.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I hope you realize that the statement you made is quite ignorant. To take something like that out of context in such a manner as you have shows a lack of intelligence.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Maybe you should stop insulting people just a second, stop quoting scripture, and have a mind of your own. Just for a bit.Try it. You might surprise yourself.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I wasn't aiming to insult you. I was simply stating the matter of the fact of what you just said. If you included a well-rounded argument, with liable information and support, I would have dignified you with such a response. I swear, some people have nothing better to do than run around being offended.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I'm not offended...i'm not gay. But you know, you can really just be pretty mean: 'I hope you realize that the statement you made is quite ignorant. To take something like that out of context in such a manner as you have shows a lack of intelligence' and 'Fairer? Please. You need to get your own faith straight before you run around saying you're a Christian and speaking words that tell otherwise.Fairer? Please. You need to get your own faith straight before you run around saying you're a Christian and speaking words that tell otherwise.'

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Also seriously, this is the internet. You really think I can be bothered to come up with a well rounded argument? It's 1 in the morning where I live and I've been up all night waiting for my brother to get home.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Whoa. This conversation was forever ago. But my response to that would be why enter an intelligent debate if you don't have an intelligent argument to contribute?

by Anonymous 13 years ago

I absolutely hate it when people say it's a choice. Why would someone chose something that is basically going to take away their rights and make them targets for irrational hate and prejudice?

by Anonymous 14 years ago

People are born with a propensity toward homosexual behavior, as I have said before. The choice they make is whether or not to give in.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I don't understand why so many people are against the ways of homosexuality. Love is love.Anyways its 2010 people should be "opening their eyes". On topic: +1

by Anonymous 14 years ago

(<3): There's a difference between love and lust. Homosexuality is an act of lust.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

How would you know a thing like that. Have you tried it??? If not, maybe you should before you start judging people

by Anonymous 14 years ago

If you're not gay/bisexual/lesbian then you wouldn't know for sure. I could say that a relationship between all men and women are for sex and nothing more but I won't because its not true. I have seen beautiful, happy marriages between a man and a woman and I've seen the same between gay couples.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

To PurpleKneeSox, I have never written on this website before. I probably never will again. While I am here for this fleeting moment however, let me attempt a point by point destruction of your argument. Firstly, your point about quoting out of context about the acceptance of beating of women in the bible: "Let the women learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression." (I Timothy 2:11-14) and, "But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God." (I Corinthians 11:3) "For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man. Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man." (I Corinthians 11:8-9) More follows:

by Anonymous 14 years ago

This seems to be pretty explicit. Now, as this is the incontestable word of God, there is surely no room for interpretation? If there were, could we not just assume that homosexuality is A-Ok from your earlier references. By interpreting, you understand. Or maybe you do in fact believe that women were created for men. Moving on for there is much ground to cover and oh so little time in which to cover it. You happily cite that homosexuality is lust not love. Well, isn't that nice oh all knowing one. I shall bow down to your incontestable statement without thinking a moment for myself. Or maybe not. You have no authority to deem what is right and what is wrong and don't pretend that just because you have read the rambled scrawlings of some primitive culture that you do. You know what, I don't care what you think in the comfort of your own little world. (Read on, we're not done yet)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

But don't march around as if you are the moral arbiter of society and make generalised statements about what pleases and displeases you before quoting from some old book to back you up. I think I'll be sticking with my logic and reason that has actually helped this species allow you to live in the exorbitant leisure that you and I enjoy in this modern world of ours. I've thought for myself in this life and I've formed my own opinions. I actually pity you for you evidently have not been able to do the same. Before I sign off, I think I'll just give you some reading material to help you analyse this statement of yours: "The Bible has also never in any way been historically disproved, just a side note." (see the next one)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radiocarbon_dating http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fossils http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radiometric_dating http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internal_consistency_and_the_Bible http://www.youtube.com/user/thunderf00t?blend=1&ob=4#p/a/AC3481305829426D/0/BS5vid4GkEY If you want anymore, I'm sure someone reasonable will be happy to oblige. Now, we're done.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

lol... who ever that was I love you sooo much

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I have to chuckle a bit at those websites. Why? Because of the fact that you have no doubt not looked into a single one of those. You looked them up and posted them on here as if Wikipedia, which school systems don't even allow to use as a source in graded papers, could define morality and scientific truths. You need better sources, and also, an explanation. Any Average Joe can Google "why the Bible is wrong" and list the results. To contest your first paragraph: you seem to be seeing something that is not there. Nowhere in those verses does God say that the beating of women is allowed. Those verses refer, quite obviously, actually, to the submittal of a wife to her husband, woman to man, because those are the positions God designed for either gender. The rest of your response can pretty much be summarily replied to with the statement that you are being hypocritical. I am not claiming to be some all-knowing guru, and actually nowhere have I claimed to be anything

by Anonymous 14 years ago

More than someone defending my beliefs, as you are. You claim that I am "marching around as if I am the moral arbiter of society". You're acting as if my beliefs are horrifying and absurd, when in reality your ideas are no different than mine, except for that they are on the opposite end of the spectrum. Get over yourself; defending my beliefs is an entirely different circumstance from claiming that I am "all knowing". In response to "<3": There is, in fact, a large difference between “judging” someone and saying that what they’re doing is wrong. I have several homosexual friends. I don’t condemn or reject them for living in a gay lifestyle; I show them the love of God and pray that they will see the truth. For the other “Anonymous” person who said that I must have experienced homosexuality to say that it is wrong, actually, no, I don’t. I don’t have to have murdered someone to say that murder is wrong. I don’t have to have committed adultery to...

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I'm not saying your judging gays but homosexuality is not wrong. I can tell that by your posts, that you are very dedicated to religion but if homosexuality is such a bad sin then why hasn't "God" stopped it yet?

by Anonymous 14 years ago

No, you don't have to experience homosexuality to 'know it is wrong' you have to experience it to know whether it is about lust or love.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

wrong. It doesn’t matter what perspective, homosexuality is a sin. Anyway. I’m done arguing. If you want real answers, and aren’t just here to argue, go to a website that is actually meant for conversations such as this.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

(From the friendly fellow who posted the links earlier) You are clearly smarter than the average bear. You are right on several counts. I was overly complacent on my rather longwinded retort. I shall try and be more civil here in the hope that we can strike an accord, you and I. As you say, "I'm done with arguing." You have your beliefs, I have mine. I respect that. What I do object to is when people make their beliefs known in a way which could conceivably offend a group of people. We all do it. It happens from time to time. Indeed, I am sure people could take issue with the more excited parts of my message. For this, I shall put in writing for all to see here: I apologise. That was not the correct manner to approach this. How about we go away from here with an intelligent, reasoned deal? I will go away from here and I will consider your perspective whenever confronted with a similar situation in the future. (see next)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

You will go away and consider the position of a homosexual person. Carefully and without prejudice. Let us both stop passing judgement on the way people want to live their lives. I think this is a reasonable compromise (more reasonable than most to be found on the internet. :P) I did find those links quickly but I did nevertheless read them. I suggest, in a polite, non-forceful way, that you consider reading a wide variety of scientific journals (maybe you do already). I'm not saying this to try and convert you or anything like that but, just as Jesus Christ is the centre of your life, science is the centre of mine and I find it thoroughly fascinating. Perhaps you may enjoy it too. I want to stress this now though: I don't mind what you believe! I think humanity would be better of if people stopped and looked at where they were going once in a while. So, can we agree to stop this silly debate now?

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I'm christian and I don't hate homos. However, I do disapprove of their lifestyle,but I cannot force anyone to do anything they dont want to do and I will not drive away people just because of that.I still don;t think they should be doing that ,but hey, I sin a lot too.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Im christian too, but I can't stand when people say 'it's a sin to be Gay.' If god created everything he created homesexuality, right? By the way, saying you 'dissaprove of thier lifestyles' doesn't make what you said fairer. Its not.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

You claim to be a Christian, and yet you are also claiming God to be a liar? Romans 1:25 clearly condemns the act of homosexuality. God didn't create sin; God created humans with free will and the freedom to choose Him or to reject Him. Fairer? Please. You need to get your own faith straight before you run around saying you're a Christian and speaking words that tell otherwise.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

The bible also says that Gluttony is a sin, and yet look how many obese people there are walking round in that little country of yours. I don't like the way you use 'the word of god' to insult other people. Im pretty shore thats not what it was supposed to be used for. Maybe where I live we just have a little more flexibiltiy and understanding. So don't you quote scripture to me, cos I don't need it to know that I am a christian. The fact that I ask QUESTIONS does NOT mean that I am not. PEOPLE LIKE YOU MAKE ME SO ANGRY.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I think I make you "so angry" becaue I'm challenging your faith and you can't defend what you claim to believe in against what is written in black and white in the Word of God. If you are a Christian, as you claim to be, then it should be fair to assume that you believe in the Word of God. In our world today, no more. It's sad. I'm not using the Bible to insult you, as I have said, I'm challenging your faith and putting it to the test against what you claim to believe in as a follower of Christ. And I don't understand your point in mentioning gluttony.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Sorry, I was just trying to get the point across that you can be really rude about the way you express your views. I'm 13, and what you said about 'my faith' or whatever really hurt my feelings. Your not doing your job and salting the earth, because if all christians are like you I don't want to be one.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I wouldn't call it rude, I'd call it blatant. I'm not into sugar-coating things, because it's pointless and I'd rather not beat around the bush when expressing my views. In debate, I'm blatant. When I'm talking to people, getting to know them, and trying to bring people to Christ rather than debate an issue or point, I show the love of Christ. But, as God says in Matthew 7:6, I do not cast my pearls before swine. These people don't want to come to Christ, they want to argue until they're blue in the face. And so I don't bother with fluff. I'm 15, by the way.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Ok, whatever. This is really lame and I am so done with you

by Anonymous 14 years ago

You are not testing this poster's faith, you are asserting that your interpretation of the bible is accurate and that theirs is not. Consider their point of view. For the sake of all that is good, consider what you are doing with your life and question your own assertions and beliefs. Should you really substitute thought with scripture? Is there really any evidence that what you believe is true? Before you quote bible at me again, think about your response, is the bible truly the font of all wisdom? Is it to be taken literally at every turn? Is there any evidence that it was inspired by some divine entity and not simply written by man?

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Thanks :) you say it way better than I do

by Anonymous 14 years ago

It's alright, if you should ever need my aid, close your eyes and say my name three times, then email me.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Ok, I'll make sure I do that :D

by Anonymous 14 years ago

And by the way... how the hell do you know that 'homosexuality is an act of lust' Have you ever TRIED IT?????????

by Anonymous 14 years ago

As states above: I don’t have to have murdered someone to say that murder is wrong. I don’t have to have committed adultery to say that adultery is wrong. It doesn’t matter what perspective, homosexuality is a sin.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

According to your bible. Try and find an objective reason to object to homosexuality.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Romans 1:25-27. Leviticus 20:13. Leviticus 18:22. To name a few.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Romans 1:26-27: Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion Leviticus 18:22 - You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination. Leviticus 20:13 - If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act; they shall surely be put to death. Their bloodguiltiness is upon them.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

No, I think they meant... according to you bible; try and find an OBJECTIVE reason to object to homosexuality. I'm not saying I agree with this... i'm just saying you totally just backed up thier point. Congrats ;)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

No! No! No! Objective, without bias. Do not use scripture as your sole argument. All you are proving is that whoever wrote the bible thought that gay men were weird and unnatural. Ignore for a moment your belief in god and try and think of a reason of your own.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Actually, 2 Timothy 3:16 says that all Scripture is inspired by God. It's not just "whoever wrote the Bible thought this". It's what God says is right and wrong. Without God, we are nohing. Words from the mouth of God are not biased. I'm done arguing here. It's repetitive to continue any further.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

you spelt nothing wrong. Ooops

by Anonymous 14 years ago

XD Do you feel better about yourself now?

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Huh? What is this in reply to and to whom is it directed?

by Anonymous 14 years ago

It was directed toward the Anonymous poster who felt the need to point out one of my few spelling errors.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

ye... i pretty much do ;)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

It is not repetitive to argue further. The reason that you choose to hide behind scripture is because that is all you have. Look at my earlier post, I am a Christian converted to atheism. I believe in something just as you do. Where you believe in the incontrovertible word of god, I believe in the purity of the scientific method. The difference is that what I believe is honest. Science does not claim to have all the answers, it doesn't even claim that it will ever have all the answers. What it says is that this is the truth as we understand it. And it gives evidence. Evidence that can be measured. Evidence that can be quantified and used to draw alternative conclusions. If you can put together a coherent, evidence supported argument for discriminating against or even simply disliking homosexuals, I would be forced to consider your point of view. (more)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

If no one could contest this theoretical argument, my own beliefs dictate that I should then see discrimination of homosexuals as a laudable act. You will find yourself incapable of making any such argument for this or, indeed, for the existence of any divine, extra universal entity.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

If you don't want to discuss this here, I'm happy to move this discussion elsewhere, perhaps to email if you wish. If you want to, reply and we'll sort something out.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Nah, I'm good. Continuing the discussion is really quite pointless, seeing as I've stated my opinions as clearly as I felt need be, and yet it seems that the people here have gone from attacking my beliefs to attacking me. First it was my belief about homosexuality, and now they're just happy to twist my words and whine because I didn't say what they wanted to hear the way they wanted to hear it. I do not discriminate against homosexuals, as you say, simply because I believe that homosexuality is a sin. It's hard for me to get my mind around how no one seems to be able to understand that. As you put it, yes, I "hide behind Scripture", because if the Word of God did not lay out the morals of man, I would have no place to say what is sin and what is not. If the Bible didn't speak against homosexuality, I wouldn't be here discussing it. I do believe in loving all people, regardless of their sins, because God loved me first and I am a sinner as well.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

You've been saying that homosexuals should repress their feelings and simply obey scripture, that seems pretty inflammatory to me. You should consider what I said, though, the general stuff about questioning your beliefs. Just as you would encourage others to seek out a Christian preacher, I would encourage you to seek out a secular thinker and discuss your ideas with them.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Ok. As I've said. I have several homosexual friends who I do discuss this kind of thing with, frequently. And, for the first part: Yes, it's the same kind of thing I would say to an adulterous man, or a student who is constantly tempted to cheat; the whole idea of following Christ and trying to be like Him is deciding that serving Him is more important than your desires of this world. It's no different for homosexuality, another sin. I understand it's inflammatory. That's why the Pharisees wanted to kill Jesus; he angered people. Didn't say what they wanted to hear. There's a pattern here.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I'll go ahead and reply to the below posts here. You think I don't know about the innumerous verses in the Bible about love and peace? If you wanted me to rain verses of love on you, then you should be commenting on a post about love and peace. This is a discussion about homosexuality. I'm stating my opinions, as is everyone else in this thread, and frankly, if you can't take the heat, it's best to leave the kitchen. What does sugar-coating things do for you? It covers what you're really saying so that we can all be "non-offensive" and "politically correct". I couldn't care less. What I say here is what I believe and nothing less. Apparently you aren't much for mature discussion, because when I don't say things the way you want to hear it, you resort to attacking me rather than what the original thread was about.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

One: I'm not bothered by any perceived sugar coating. I am not saying what I am saying out of any desire to water down my feelings, quite the opposite. I was inspired to post here because I was outraged that some young, religious, homosexual kid might see your posts and decide that they should repress their nature to conform with what their religion says. Personally, I feel that Christianity, taken at face value, is a hugely irresponsible faith system with far too many internal inconsistencies and a long, unhealthy history of use by the powerful to control the weak. Though I do admit that by simply cherry-picking what parts of the religion to emphasize or believe in, one can form a decent, socially responsible and moral system. You seem to have memorized the bible, or you at least know your way around it. So I hardly believe that you couldn't quote the pleasant parts. (more coming...)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Secondly: I do not believe that I was mounting a personal attack against you. I have attempted several times in this thread to reason with you, particularly by trying to persuade you to argue without the crutch of scripture. I was doing this because I feel strongly about that and because your "opinions" throughout this thread are nothing of the sort. They are instead the opinions of a bunch of long-dead scholars that you have adopted and appear to be unable to do without. By learning not to rely on scripture you would become a more potent adversary in debates. I might also have hoped that you would question your own belief more thoroughly than I suspect you have. Thirdly: I believe in what I said below, I think that by arguing anyone who has stated that homosexuality is a sin or has otherwise expressed an unfounded objection to homosexuality, any future readers of this thread will be persuaded to keep an open mind on this issue. (still more...)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

You see, if it is taken as true that homosexuality is a sin, as you have asserted, then if scripture is our guide there, why should scripture not also guide the hand of judgement and punishment? You say you have a few gay friends, would you have them persecuted for their feelings? I imagine not, you seem to be a smart kid. There are, however, less tolerant people in this world, and Christianity fosters many of these people, who look less kindly on these issues. In many African nations, homosexuality is against the law, because it is against Christian law. Homosexuals are forced to hide that part of their lives to avoid persecution or prosecution. There are actually influential and rich western Christian organizations that fund those in Africa and other places who enact Christian laws as state laws. (I'll get to the end soon...)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

This has caused many deaths due to AIDs and other STIs (due to the Catholic church's ban on contraceptives) and from illegal, unsafe abortions (proper medical abortions being illegal due to Christian laws). I imagine you live in a secular country with secular laws and a healthy tolerance of other people (I can't remember whether you've said where you live), but your scripture is not tolerant and it has harsh punishments for those that disobey it. And hey, who are you to question the "word of god" and say that a punishment is too harsh. As we can see, your opinions on this matter are not entirely formed from scripture but also from your environment, otherwise you would have visited some strange and arcane execution upon your friends in accordance with scripture. If you wouldn't have, then you may have been obeying one part of the bible "Thou shalt not kill," but the bible has plenty of exceptions for that one in particular and plenty of contradictions in general. (last one)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

If you're going to be Christian and take the bible as truth, as you so clearly do, then you're going to have to only accept parts of the bible. You can't accept them all because there are contradictions. How do you choose which bits to obey and which bits to not obey? Anyway, I've wandered from my point, this is perhaps symptomatic of posting at 4AM, but I hope that you now know why I and others did what we did. I sincerely hope that you will have a look at what your beliefs really are and why you hold them. Oh yeah, and I said that you should talk to someone secular, someone who has already spent a lot of time thinking on their beliefs, someone as a parallel to whomever your preacher is, I wasn't really talking about people your own age, or people who are specifically gay. Please reply if you got this far, I am truly interested in debate, not personal attacks, as I, again, hope that I have made clear.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

That was the last one.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I'll reply to this summarily... I believe I said before that I was done arguing, because this conversation is going in circles. To many of the points you have made, I have already posted a reply earlier that you must have overlooked. "As you put it, yes, I "hide behind Scripture", because if the Word of God did not lay out the morals of man, I would have no place to say what is sin and what is not. If the Bible didn't speak against homosexuality, I wouldn't be here discussing it." The entire Bible is either true or not true. If only some parts are truth, then the entire thing must be false, because it says within itself that the entire Bible is inspired by God. But, I believe I've said that before as well. Also as I've said, this conversation is not for a website as frivolous as amirite. All of these replies to your replies already have replies. That's all I wish to say further on the matter.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I did not overlook that post. I asked you to attempt to form your own views without the crutch of scripture. Very well, you don't want to do that, perhaps you feel that it is impossible to do so. Question, instead, whether it is right to hold the views of your scripture. Look at whether your assumption that god wrote the bible holds up to rational scrutiny. Is there any independent evidence for his existence? You say that if one part of the bible is false, the whole thing is false. Does that mean that to convert you I need only disprove one "fact" from the bible?

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Because that would be a trivial task.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Were the last three sentences invisible...? I *could* spend all day sitting around, replying, but I have a life to live.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Uh huh?

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Do you know what I really can't understand. You accuse people of launching 'peronal attacks' on you, and yet YOU are the one calling people stupid immature and unreasonable...hmm

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Saying that a statement a person has made is "stupid immature and unreasonable" is not the same as launching a personal attack on a person. Actually, I don't recall having called anyone unreasonable on here. Don't put words in my mouth. What I mean by "personal attacks" is that some people on here have begun to whine about my saying things in a way they don't like to hear it, rather than discussing our differing opinions on the issue at hand. It's quite annoying.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

"Apparently you aren't much for mature discussion, because when I don't say things the way you want to hear it, you resort to attacking me rather than what the original thread was about." That's a pretty personal attack on me.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Because I said you aren't much for mature discussion? Please.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

It's clearly a personal attack on me, I'm not saying that it brings tears to my eyes. Besides, I thought we were done here as a result of you not wanting anyone to question your faith.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

D@67563 (Cowscape): hi it's me... the 13 year old girl again. I was just going to say to both of you, don't you think it's a bit sad that you're both still arguing about this? go live your lives ;)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

OK, now I'm gonna stop procrastinating and do my french homework :P bye

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Hey! I enjoy debate. Though normally it isn't as frustrating as this. Anyway, I think we're done here. Court dismissed, bring in the dancing lobsters.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I have sooo heard that before :)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I stole it from MLIA, I have no shame :)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I'm glad that you are so honest and open with yourself and others :D

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Very well, disperse immediately, this is a dragon-only meeting area.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Fine... bye bye. I won't have anyone calling me a dragon.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

and one last thing. The fact that it MIGHT be a choice doesn't matter so much when you think that maybe that person CHOOSES TO BE GAY.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

It'd help in identifying who is who if you would grow a pair and post your name.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Hi, I'm a 13 year old girl, I live in England, and I don't like the way you express your views atall. It is fine to have your own views, but why do you have to be so mean about them? I don't have a profile. I'm not sad. Is that enough information for you?

by Anonymous 14 years ago

What? Not responding now you've found out I'm just a little girl?

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Actually, I was responding to other posts, thanks. I wouldn't call it mean, I'd call it blatant. I don't sugar-coat things when I'm in a debate; I don't cast my pearls before swine. I'm a 15 year old girl, by the way.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

So, why would I care who you are? Maybe sometimes 'sugar coating' is the best way to go. As far as I can see you haven't been spreading all that much love. The only scripture you've used in this whole conversation is about punishing gays. Why not round off our nice little chat with a NICE quote from scripture shall we? 'And god so loved the world, he gave his only son'. I don't know where it comes from. I don't think it realy matters.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

on the mountain of the lord it will be provided

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Shout to the lord, all the earth. Serve the LORD with joy; come before him singing

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I will make the darkness come to light for the, and the rough ground smooth. I will not leave my people

by Anonymous 14 years ago

sing for joy to god, our strength

by Anonymous 14 years ago

The lord will defend his people and have mercy on his servants

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Oh dear, I think I'm in love with a 13 year old girl. I wonder whether I can get therapy for this or whether I should just hand myself in now. Seriously, though, well done. Through the combined efforts of those in this thread it has been made clear that baseless discrimination is simply not acceptable.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

OK... well in that case, I'm going to bed :) It's 2 o'clock in the morning and my brother just came in the door :D

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Goodnight, kid. It's two o'clock here too. Funny that, me living in the UK and all. :)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

:)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I gotta ask, are you an IB Student, or is this just the way you learn to articulate across the pond?? haha But seriously, I had no idea this was such a hotbed issue anywhere but the US...my mistake.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I'm actually a student studying exclusively scientific A-Levels in England. I was part of a debating society for a while, however, and I take a great interest in these things. Thanks, though. :)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

You don't go to QE boys do you? That would be sooo wierd!

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I don't know what QE boys is, so I guess not, sorry :)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

:( oh.. ok wait... habsboys?

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Never heard of it, sorry.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

now we have recieved gods mercy 1Peter 2:10

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Hi. I just read this little argument thing you got going on here. Its good to read some loving bible verses for once :)

by Anonymous 14 years ago

amen =]

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I think it's funny there are 169 Yes's and 69 No's.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I know right?

by Anonymous 14 years ago

yeah... i just choose to be a minority.

by Anonymous 13 years ago