well religion never meant that a man pray for fish without doing anything to seek it, it means that he seeks a way to find something to eat while praying God that he finds it. this way he might actually have a double chance of finding fish

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Yep, thats not quite how religion is. We are still humans, here on earth, so we still have to work for things and struggle even with God on our side.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Let me ask you this then, if God loves you, why doesn't he just give you the fish?

by Anonymous 14 years ago

because your life is not about the luxuries in it, it's about making out the best of it with the greatest amount of good deeds. and the situation of you not finding food might be a blessing if you look at it that God is making you to come back to Him and ask Him to help you find food. only if you are spiritually week at the time , will you consider God not to love you just for not giving you the fish

by Anonymous 14 years ago

A) I don't understand how not having enough to eat could possibly be a blessing. B) You can still do good deeds even if you do not believe in God, but you do it for the sake of being a good person, not so that you can get in to heaven. C) What if a man does not understand that and eventually dies from a lack of food? Wouldn't that be blood on God's hands? D) It is spelled weak, not week. E) Please fix your sentence structure so that people can understand what you are saying without having to re-read your post five times.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Oh, by the way, having to ask somebody to help you find food is not a blessing in my book. If you did not depend on God all of the time, you probably would have learned how to do these things on your own.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

With his shiny concealed blades, the Assassin has struck to the core of the conversation.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

hahaha

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I don’t get why you got all warmed up, but anyway what I meant is that religion tells you that your life now is a test that determines where you will be after you die. So if you believe this, what you were born into or what you have at the moment of material things wouldn't matter much because your main purpose is to obey God and try to make out the best of your life. And what I mean by making out the best of your life is to get your education and work and help make the Earth a better place for living (And that is another way of getting closer to heaven). About doing good things just for the sake of being a good person, well that always puzzled me how people think that way and I would like someone to explain to me, if I don’t have a religion and I was born into a rich and powerful family then what stops me from doing whatever I want without caring for any rules around me?

by Anonymous 14 years ago

You pretty much just proved my own point. How nice of you. That is the difference between people like you and people like me. People like you need incentives. You can't really say that much of what they do is done because of the good person that they are, because in the end, their goal is to reach heaven. And we all know, that in order to reach heaven, you must be a good person. It is all about how you are raised, and actually, it would make a lot of sense to me if a rich person was more likely to believe in God because they just have things handed to them, and never learn to question anything. On the other hand, a poor person would pray to God for help. It really is just about the kind of person you are. You do good things for the sake of others, not for selfish reasons like getting into heaven.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I think you made a totally wrong picture of me. It seems that you have assumed that since I was born I’ve been this religious person (which I’m still not), but that’s not true. My mum had always been religious when my day was just easy bout it and gave us the atheist view to think about. Until last year, I was just like you, I did good things purely because I felt good about them and that is what my conscious allowed –and that is not exactly selfless- and I was just fine because life was easy and I always made the right choices until I faced a situation in which my principles were tested and I surprised myself by breaking some of them. So that’s when I realised what all those people following my religion realised before and that is that following your religion’s orders won’t be the only way to do good things in your everyday life but it’s bound to help you in hard situations. I knew that if I was religious at the time I still would have d...

by Anonymous 14 years ago

And when you considered what if this man died at that moment because God didn’t give him anything to eat, then if you think of it, no kind of death is a good one except when the one dying knows while he dies that he is going somewhere better. So if at that time, this person’s credit is a positive one and he died on the right religion, then that person wouldn’t consider it bad at all. And when you said that because I ask God to HELP me find fish then that’s why I can’t do it, that’s just changing what I said! What I said here and I thought was pretty clear is that you will learn to do it and you will ask God to aid you in the task and you won’t depend totally on Him because you won’t expect a miracle, like the fish just jumping into your hands without doing anything. Finally I hope that you consider reading about religions and research it deeply until you find a solution that convinces you and that you don’t find loopholes in.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

But, you see, this is just a big circle then. You cannot have an arguement like this with statements that are not backed up by logical reasoning. Reffering back to the man dying, you say that no death is a good one if you are not going somewhere better. What if that man doesn't go to a better place? Then it would be blood on God's hands. Even if his "credit" was not a positive one, shouldn't God give him a chance? This just brings us back to the beginning really.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Oh and hey, I've got a question. You do recognize that there are other religions out there today right? And that there have been numerous other religions before the start of Christianity? Well, then what happened to all of those other people? The ones that did not even know of Christianity. It wouldn't exactly be fair to them if they were all sent to hell. They didnt even know about Jsus Christ. Considering the fact that your God is supposed to be a fair one that loves everyone, woulnd't that just deprive him of his Godlike status? I guess that was more than one question. Oh well.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Jesus* wouldn't*

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Again you misjudged me and made wrong assumptions. You assumed that I am a Christian and that’s not true because-surprisingly I’m sure-I’m a Muslim. So you ask about those people who didn’t hear about the true religion and that really puzzled me for a long time and I asked the people around me about it so I’ll just give you my religion’s point of view. We believe that people who didn’t get the chance of knowing the truth will not be blamed, but God will test them in the final judgement. The kind of test, I can’t remember but it seemed at the time to be equal to living your life receiving messages about the true religion.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

The man you’re talking about already had a chance of searching and going back to God all his life, so he had many chances. And that in my point of view is just fair, because in my religion we believe that if a man who didn’t follow the right religion and found it in the end (even if he is on his deathbed) then God will accept him and will turn all his sins into good deeds because that’s how far he has gone and that’s how hard it was for him to accept religion. Your argument also makes me wonder why we don’t blame this person who is correcting the exam papers and fails a lazy student

by Anonymous 14 years ago

i showed my posts to a friend and she told me she didnt get what i meant. of course this is simply because im not a professional speaker, so if u find anything hard to understand or not clear enough please point it out

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Nobody here is a professional speaker. At least, I don't think so.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

Anyway, what I think bothers you about religious people is that you see them most of the time just praying God for forgiveness and help, and I agree with you in the end that this won’t make them eat. And that’s why I am perfectly comfortable with the fact that Islam says that, if there are two brothers where the first prays to God all day and his brother works and helps other people, the one closer to God is the working one. It came in more than one time in the Quran that God loves a productive man and in more than one story that our prophet (PBUH) told people to work and he worked himself so this shows that just being someone who invites people to obey God doesn’t mean that you won’t do something useful with your life. So in conclusion religious figures sitting around all day is just wrong and you won’t find that in good Islamic believers

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I agree with you on some of the points you made and I'm sorry if I misjudged you, but you are not entirely correct about why religion bothers me. It is more ignorance than anything else, but of course, not all religious people are ignorant. You aren't, but I believe that most are. Some just can't say anything besides "Because he loves us" when their beliefs are question and just become upset. But, nevertheless, I think it all comes down to your personality. If you are the type of person that has to see it to believe it or have some sort of proof, like me, then you will most likely be atheist. I have heard both sides of the story, but to me, all of the proof points toward the belief that there is no divine being out there.

by Anonymous 14 years ago

I know it probably makes no difference to you whatsoever, TheRomanianAssassin, but I am a Southern Baptist and I am praying for you. And by the way, God loves you even if you don't believe in him.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

-_- Of course he does...

by Anonymous 13 years ago

I'm happy that at least I made some difference to your view of believers and maybe someday you'll find that proof you're talking about.

by Anonymous 14 years ago