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Gay marriage should be legal, amirite?
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Because the only reason it's not is religious and religion should have no place in laws like that. Not everyone is Christian (or Muslim, or whatever other religion that says homosexuality is wrong). Same-sex marriage is between two consenting adults and affects nobody but the people involved. You should have the right to marry the one you love (provided nobody is harmed, i.e., an adult and a child should NOT be allowed to marry). Also, marriage above union as there are way more rights granted in a marriage than any union.
I agree with your statement. I was just wondering how an adult marrying a child affects anyone except those who are involved?
Because it's child abuse and rape and a child cannot legally give consent, whereas two adults can. The child is hurt. Same-sex marriage doesn't hurt anyone.
Oh okay the difference is how many days you have lived. Don't get me wrong because I really don't care if two gay people get married, really it is the least of my concerns. Just trying my hands at the Devil's advocate. Thank you for explaining.
The difference is consent, not age. A child (an animal, a dead body) can't consent. Two adults can.
Okay now I'm a bit confused. A child can not give concent because they can not love, or because legally they are not of age?
Because they are legally not old enough to give consent, yes. But that has to do with brain development and it's relation to age, not just the number of years you've existed. It's what that number of years means.
Okay that makes a little more sense. I won't argue with that point.
Also, I'm pretty sure people who have developmental disabilities (I think this the current term, forgive me if I'm wrong) also can't give consent (I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure they can't, or maybe it depends on what the developmental disability is, not sure).
I couldn't tell you.
Well if it's not so, I think it should be. Though on an individual case basis.
So you're saying mentally challenged people can't legally have sex? I don't know the law on that either, but my gut says that has to be incorrect. That would be a very discriminating law to take away someone's basic right based on how intelligent they are.
I'm not saying it is, but I'm saying it should be (but on a case by case basis). It should depend on how capable they are of making decisions for themselves. Some people who are mentally challenged are as capable as a 2 year old at making decisions. Others are as capable as any adult. They should be looked at individually, so they aren't taken advantage of (which is something that happens all too often). My main concern with this idea is that people who are mentally challenged (or even with mental illnesses) should be protected from being taken advantage of. However, that's probably too difficult to accomplish properly. And, like you said, would in some cases possibly discriminate. I'm not saying it should be based on intelligence, per se, but on their mental age (if that makes sense).
The only reasons that people oppose gay marriage are: 1. They are against it because of religion, or 2. They just think it is unnatural or weird. The first reason shouldn't even be considered in the government because we are not a theocracy. The second reason is faulty because who are you to stand in the way of people's happiness? Just because you think it's "weird", two people in love shouldn't be allowed to get married? What if I think it's weird that you and your partner have the same hair color? Can I outlaw your marriage?
There are more arguments against gay marriage too. Some argue that it will decay families. Or it will lead to more perversion of marriage like polygamy. Another argument is that is will put kids in gay families or subject them to sexual perversion that parents might ultimately be required to accept as natural and okay. Sure banning gay marriage because of religion or "ew" is probably wrong, but i think other arguments give much more valid reasons against allowing a gay couple to marry.
Decay families? There are plenty of gay couples that are much more fit for parenthood than a lot of straight couples. And how would gay marriage lead to polygamy? Even if it did, what's wrong with polygamy? Homosexuality isn't "perversion", and why would gay marriage encourage perversion anyway? Homosexuality IS natural and okay. I don't think any of those arguments are valid.
Gay marriage changes the definition of 1 man and 1 woman to 2 people. What's stopping that from being changed to 3 people? There are a lot of problems with polygamy; there's a reason it isn't legal anymore. Homosexuality is perversion. Perversion is changing to or being of an unnatural or abnormal kind, turning from what is right, being wicked or misguided.Homosexuality is definitely that. I believe it is unnatural and not okay.
The reason that polygamy is illegal is because people are afraid of anything that is different and against tradition. Not because it causes harm. People just don't think it is "right". And sigh homosexuality is very natural. Animals in the wild do it. We're the unnatural ones for condemning homosexuality.
So anything animals do is okay for us to do? And don't call humans unnatural for condemning homosexuality because animals cant condemn homosexuality. They cant condemn anything, but it is necessary that we do( murder, theft, etc). You cant compare animals and human, because that apples to oranges.
No, not anything animals do is okay for us to do, but that does make it natural. Just because it's unusual doesn't make it unnatural. And if your problem is that it's unnatural, why not go live in the forest with wold animals and wear a loincloth? Your car is unnatural. Your fridge, your hairbrush, your shower. And what makes you say that animals can't condemn things?
There is no scientific evidence to suggest that any of that is true. Kids are no more likely to grow up (with homosexual parents instead of heterosexual parents) gay or in any form of trouble or any worse off.
Oh really? Research by social scientists, although not definitive, suggests that children reared by openly homosexual parents are far more likely to engage in homosexual behavior than children raised by others. Studies thus far find between 8% and 21% of homosexually parented children ultimately identify as non-heterosexual. For comparison purposes, approximately 2% of the general population are non-heterosexual. http://www.drtraycehansen.com/P...s_prohomo.html
The studies suggest correlation, but never cause. Chances are, if your parents are gay, you won't have much of a problem coming out to them. There is NO evidence that suggests that a child will be "made" homosexual by homosexual parents.
I'd say being 5 times more likely to be homosexual because your parents are is a cause...
5 times more likely to be OPENLY homosexual. There's more to that silly statistic than the numbers. Like I said, correlation does not mean causation.
People say that if gay people were allowed to marry, it would ruin the sanctity of marriage. Straight people have ruined it with their high divorce rates and quickie marriages. Not every straight person has tarnished the name and not every gay person will have a pristine marriage; however they are people first and therefore are entitled to the right.
Don't like it, Don't do it
I like murder
I don't consent to being murdered.
If it doesn't affect you, then don't be mad about it.
(aka half of these arguments)
There is no logical reason to be against gay marriage, coming from an ex-gay hater.....
so what if they love each other what stops them
NW? I'm actually surprised.
woah! thanks!
Because it shouldn't offend or concern anyone but the two.
It should be legal, at least in the US, because a big part of our country is our promise that you can follow any religion you want, or no religion at all, and we won't stone you or imprison you or throw you out of town. Every culture, even ancient ones, had marriage or something like it, so it's not like Christians have any kind of exclusive right to the practice. So why is something that's not religious illegal for religious reasons in a country that promises not to get involved with religion?
Christians don't have any kind of exclusive right to the practice...Any man and woman can get married.
For everyone saying that it's "unnatural"....
Let it be said right here that roughly 90% of giraffe sex is male on male. A further 1% of giraffe sex is female on female. Meaning only 9% of all giraffe sex is heterosexual.
Fun fact of the day!
That's probably for domination purposes.
Who studies this shit?!
It should be legal. Like many have said, the only reason it's not is because of bigoted religious beliefs, and religion should not be mixed with political issues.
My best friend is gay, and it angers me that people who have absolutely nothing to do with him, and will probably never encounter him, have the power to say wether or not he can marry the man of his dreams.
It pisses me off to no end. Let them do whatever the hell they want to do. It's no ones business but theirs.
BUT, when it comes down to preachers...I think it's the preacher's decision on wether to marry them or not. If the preacher truly believes he CAN'T marry them due to religious beliefs (since he is a religious leader), then fine. But it shouldn't be completely outlawed anywhere.
I agree with you 100%
I think it should be legal because it is not like it is going to harm anybody physically if anything it helps people. I also think that the reason of having to dicsuss to your kids how 2 people of the same gender are getting married is kind of terrible. Whenever a little kid asks me a question it has nothing to do with other people and I doubt little kids really care why Uncle Jerry married Uncle Ben for a different reason then why Aunt Erin married Uncle Aaron.
When I was little, about 5 or 6 I believe, my mom told me my Aunt Penny was going to be living with her friend Tanya. I said, "Oh! They must be gay!" Even at that age I understood, and my little self didn't give a damn (much as my current self doesn't). I was happy to welcome my Aunt Tan to the family.
Tan sounds like a cool name.
Haha well to me they're Pen and Tan :)
there is homosexuality in all species, but homophobia is only in one.
Homophobia, like sin, free will, and a conscience, is only present in humans because humans are the only ones with that intellect. God didn't give that intellect to anyone else. Human nature is a body-soul unity.
monkeys steal, isnt that a sin?
No it is not because they do not have a conscience or a free will. A monkey is an animal they don't have the same nature that a human does. They have instinct not intellect.
You haven't studied monkeys have you? They certainly do have intellect and a social structure and emotions.
multiple things wrong there.
1) there is no proof monkeys do not have a conscience.
2) monkeys do a lot of the same things as humans do (to a lesser extent of course)
3) monkeys can use technology, and have created tools of their own. thats intelligence/intellect
Certainly not in all species.
because who cares what other people do with their lives if they're not hurting anybody else it's none of our business
Preventing gay people from getting married won't keep them from being gay, it won't stop them from loving each other, it won't change their relationship. It's just pure discrimination, and denying them the right to marry the person whom they love benefits nobody. Even if you personally don't like gay people, their marriage affects you in no way shape or form and your personal beliefs shouldn't dictate the lives of others. If you want to argue against gay marriage for religious reasons, that brings attention to the fact that atheists can get married while gays can't (which obviously isn't a problem). While maybe at one point marriage was more religious and whatnot, things have changed, and again you have no right to tell others what they can and can't do based purely on your individual beliefs. If you want to argue that the institute of marriage is being ruined, look at all of the straight marriages ending in divorce.
Basically, mind your own business. Gay people have done nothing wrong, they just want (and are entitled to) equality. Gay, straight, bisexual, transgender, we are all PEOPLE. Not everybody is the same, and we need to be more accepting of each other.
I just wanted to say that the amount of responses has been phenomenal. Thank You.
After reading all these comments, I couldn't ask for a better selection of intellectual opinions.
I also learned that nobody can come up with a legitimate non religious reason to be against gay marriage. (I'd still love to hear one)
No offence to religious people because I can understand where they are coming from, but there is a clear line between what your individual religion deems acceptable and the law.
Well The government shouldn't be allowed to decide who you can and cannot get married to. Who you decide marry should be between you and you the person you marry.
I'm glad you are intelligent enough to disagree with that argument because it implies that everyone who was raised by a single parent is screwed up which is of course not true.
That and there is no scientific evidence that supports that argument. Only evidence that proves it to be untrue.
I don't agree with that either. One of my best friends was adopted as a baby by a lesbian couple, and she isn't "screwed up" in any way.
...It never says in the bible that gay marriage is unholy. Nowhere. If you're referring to other holy books, I have less knowledge of them, but for any Jew or Christian the Bible shouldn't be made an excuse. It was two thousand and eleven years ago when Jesus was born, so as holy and revered as the Bible is and should be, people should take it with a grain of salt- it wasn't written exactly recently.
Also, why is it (gay marriage) so debated in the first place? It IS perfectly natural! Animals are homosexual too! Animals and humans (yes, humans are animals, but lets just separate them for now) are the only two types of beings who specifically pick their partner/mate, and since all species in those categories also pick mates/partners of the same gender, who can say it's unnatural?
This is just my opinion, just what I believe. But it would be really amazing to be referenced or whatever in your report.
Just for your information Jesus was born 2015 years ago.
It says it any number of times in the Old Testament. I am not currently aware of a specific example in the New Testament, but I am under the impression that I saw it once.
Marriage was a covenant between adam and eve.
Just because it doesn't say "Gay marriage is wrong" in those exact words doesn't mean it's not there. I personally am against gay marriage more because of society reasons, but because of religion too. If someone even remotely argues with religion, the other side will use it to their advantage "OH OOHHH YOU ONLY HATE GAYS CUZ GOD SAYS SO, GOD DON'T TELL ME WHAT TO DO STOP SHOVING YOUR RELIGION DOWN MY THROAT!!!!1ONE!".
was he.
Here are your references. Lectivius 18:22 and 20:13. Romans 1:24-32. 1 Corinthians 6:9-11.
Just for your information Jesus was born 2015 years ago.
Don't you absolutely HATE when two men in another state who have nothing to do with you get married? I just HATE that.
Speaking in terms of the Constitution, all citizens of the United States should have the same rights, regardless of sex, race, or religion. Religion shouldn't interfere with a citizen's rights in ANY way. So, yes, gay people should have the right to marry. I'm sick and tired of all the discrimination against homosexual people. How is what we're doing now any different from what we did during the era of slavery, when we didn't accept black people as citizens and continued to discriminate against them for God knows how long? Every person that was born in the United States is a citizen and with that citizenship comes rights. It's really not that hard to comprehend. It's just religion that's making this decision more complicated than it has to be.
Might have been said before, but who are we to stop two people that love each other from getting married? If you don't like gay marriages, don't get one. I'm a Christian and I know that people will be like "Gay people will go to hell..it's in the Bible". So if they're already supposedly going to hell, why not let them be happy on earth? Long story short, it should be just as legal as straight marriage, no questions asked.
Exactly. I don't really care if people think it's wrong so long as they don't try to make laws affecting me. They have the right to think what they want, but they need to let me have the right to think and do what I want as well.
Love is blind, and can overcome sex, religion, class, race, and just about everything else imaginable. As long as the marriage is between two consenting adults, what else matters?
The Bible is biased anf flawed just like every other source. Things were left out. Some probably on purpose some by mistake. Then there's the fact that it was translated, which often yields mistakes. It was also written during a completely different time period. And lastly, it was written by humans, and we most certaintly aren't perfect.
simple, it should be legal because it is their constitutional right to persue happiness. there is no real meaningful reason why its even illegal in the first place. rather you are against it or not it is no ones right to stop two people who love each other and rip them of their constitutional rights just because their narrow minds cant grasp that a couple of the same sex is no different then a couple of opposing sex's other then the small fact that they have sex in a different manner.
absolutely.do we, or do we not believe that everyone is created equal? if we adhere to that belief then gay people should be allowed to marry. it doesnt threaten me. i dont know why it would for anyone else.
I think it should be legal... love is love; it doesn't matter who's involved. Honestly, if one person really loves another, he/she should be able to marry that person. It's a really terrible thought, people trying to intervene with love. No one would ever imagine preventing a wedding between a straight couple; why should it be any different with a homosexual one?
Basic human rights. And unmarried couples are denied a ton of benefits that married couples receive, such as tax breaks, insurance, etc. Gay couples should have the right to be human and to be happy. Why should we make life so much more difficult for them because of who they love?
Also, civil unions do not carry the same number of rights that marriage does.
Gay marriage is still marriage. It is between two consenting adults. In the bible it also says that a wife is to "serve" her husband (or something along the lines of a husband being in charge) but how often do you see religious protests about how women's rights are unholy? And even athiests aren't given as much shit about going to hell as gays are. Equal is equal. It does not affect anyone and no one is forced to have a gay marriage in any way (in most cases I'd pressume). I think gay and straight couples should be equal in the most equal sense. If a straight couple can kiss in a Disney movie, I say a gay couple kissing should be just as socially acceptable. I don't think they should be treated at a higher standard and get special benefits for being gay but I think they should be given the exact same rights. You can't not hire someone because if religion so you shouldn't be about to not hire someone for their sexuality. Lastly I think people need to not use a person's sexuality to characterize a person. In tv shows and whatnot, a gay character isn't just a gay character. They're sexuality is the most mentioned thing about them and they're usually the comic relief which is silly.
Old Testament law is said in the New Testament to not be taken because we no longer have to. I'm tired of people taking that stuff out of context.
I haven't read the entire bible but I have read quite a bit. I actually thought that the husband and wide part was in the new testament but I guess I was wrong. I'm sorry for the mistake. :P
Wife* sorry I'm using my iPod
It is in the new testament. Corinthians I believe.
A large portion of "Christian Law" (which while in the Bible is actually Jewish law) is found in the Old Testament.
I am a Christian and I too hate when people take the old testament out of context. It is used to show where alot of the laws in the new testament comes from. But there is a verse in corinthians that says that homosexualality is wrong. I don't push my beliefs down the throats of others so please do the same. I don't believe in it because that's my religion. But I am not a "gay basher" and a majority of other christians aren't either so don't generalize us as that.
I am Christian too. I never in any way put my own beliefs there.
No. Rituals etc. aren't to be taken because the new covenant fulfills the old one. The moral laws such as, I don't know, the ten commandments, are still in effect. The reason the Old Testament is still apart of the Bible is because it's relevant. She did still take the part about the wife out of context.
But is it not true that Jesus in the New Testament summed up all moral laws?
What? That doesn't negate the Old Testament.
It negates the moral parts that you say are in question.
No it doesn't?
All Old Testament law is irrelevant, though the Ten Commandments can be called the manifestation of a few words said in the New, no? Or am I missing something else?
Can I just put what it says in the Catechism?
This is what it says under Old Law:
CC 1963... It provides a teaching which endures for ever, like the Word of God.
The New Law of the Gospel:
CC 1968 The Law of the Gospel fulfills the commandments of the Law. The Lord's Sermon on the Mount, far from abolishing or devaluing the moral prescriptions of the Old Law, releases their hidden potential and has new demands arise from them: it reveals their entire divine and human truth.
This is what the Catechism states:
This divine pedagogy appears especially in the gift of the Law. God gave the Law as a “pedagogue” to lead his people towards Christ. But the Law’s powerlessness to save man deprived of the divine “likeness,” along with the growing awareness of sin that it imparts, enkindles a desire for the Holy Spirit. The lamentations of the Psalms bear witness to this” (CCC 708)
I also don't think your quote was spot on in the Catholic Bible.
You got me there. However, I would comment that the Beatitudes do not require the Old Testament teaching to remain true.
As a matter of curiosity, of which denomination is that catechism?
Catholic. I'm Catholic so this is my interpretation of the Bible.
Then perhaps subtle differences have led to different conclusions. To each his (her, if it really makes anyone feel better) own, shall we say?
I think that it should be legal. Of course, marriage doesn't necessary make two people's love official; no object, especially not a tiny metal circle, can do that. It's the vows and the trust that make a marriage, but really, you can have that same trust without the fancy ceremony. But marriage is mostly about the lawful benefits. A man should have the right not to testify against his wife in court, and a man shouldn't have to testify against his husband, either. Love between two people of the same sex is no less real than that of a traditional couple.
I think gay marriage should be legal. It seems to me like the only reason people ever disapprove of gay marriage has to do with religion. Why does religion dictate that we should not go after who we love?
we are god's children, and therefore we should be able to freely be with our significant other without the disapproval of ignorant pricks.
In Australia, marriage is a purely legal concept with no religious affiliation, though it may be carried out by a religious official and have religious connotations if one wishes. I believe that that is the right way to go about it, as it removes all arguments that is against their religion, as it not about religion anymore :)
Except there is no denying that matrimony is one of the seven sacraments.
So it may be one of the sacraments to you, but majority of people in Australia (very little religious types were I live) don't believe it has any religious background and is a purely legal affair. I'm sorry, but what may be sacred to you does not mean everyone else feels the same way about it.
Marriage existed long before Christianity. There is more to a marriage than the religious things you listed. People want the legal rights that come with marriage (i.e., visiting your spouse in the hospital and making decisions for them when they can't, and I believe over a thousand other rights). People want the right to celebrate their love with a legal document. It means something, something beyond religion.
It is religious. Married people vow to help the other attain their final end and grow in faith along the way. For any Christian that is. What is the purpose of marriage if you don't marry for religious purposes. You can have sex outside of marrige bounds if you aren't religious. You are not vowing to help the other grow in faith and reach Heaven. It is not a eternal vow becausenyou don't believe in the afterlife.
Just because it's religious to one person doesn't mean it's religious to everyone. Anyway, what happened to the separation of church and state?
Well for one marriage isn't solely a Christian product, many cultures have it. As for what is the purpose of marriage if it isn't religious? Is that a serious question? It's a symbol of your love and undying faith for each other (hence the ring), and to a lesser extent carries across great legal benefits that cannot be accrued if a couple aren't married. And yes they can view it as an eternal vow, as there is no such thing as the afterlife and many people have accepted that as fact, myself included.
It's Adam and EVE
Not Adam and STEVE
LOL
(I'm totally for gay marriage 100%, i was just surprised no one posted this fucking quote yet)
Absolutely. Everybody should be allowed to marry the person they love. The main reason it isn't allowed is the Bible, which is a load of horseshit because separation of church and state.
And as for the argument "it's weird", I think Uggs are weird. But everyone would be pissed if the government told them they couldn't wear a specific shoe.
I would be perfectly happy if the government banned Uggs.
Lol at you calling the most historically accurate book in the world that over 2 billion people believe in "horseshit."
Incorrect. I'm saying it shouldn't be a basis for making laws. Though, if you must know, I do find it to be horseshit. But that's a discussion for another post.
If you're coming from a religious standpoint, think about this: religious texts were written well over 1,500 years ago. Times have changed. A lot of what the bible says is now slightly, if not completely irrelevant to everyday society. And I believe that if the words 'bromance' and 'pwn' can be added to the dictionary, the definition of marriage can be altered to fit what is the new standard of marriage. Also, love is love. Who are we to put a label on what is love and what isn't? Please keep in mind that I am a cradle Catholic and that not all religious people are judgmental and think homosexuality is a sin.
I think it should. It really doesn't matter to me.. I mean, if it doesn't affect my life in any way then why should I care? Power to them!
I don't know why it SHOULDN'T be legal.
I am going to try to go through all possible arguments against gay marriage/homosexuality and attempt to disprove them. Feel free to skip
1. Religion- My god(s) says that being homosexual is a sin
2. It's not natural (in other words: ickyyy)
3. It will ruin the sanctity of marriage, therefore allowing polyamory and possibly pedophilia and/or bestiality to be legalized
4. Homosexuals can't really love each other, and they mistake lust for love
Also, these are all my opinions and therefore are not being forced onto you but rather expressed with no intention of offending you
1. First off, there are two parts to my argument. For one, it is argued whether or not homosexuality is said to be a sin in the Bible and other such texts. Another is that is specifically explained in the Constitution that there must be a separation of church and state, meaning the government can not make any decisions based off of what a religion tells them to do. I'm going to focus on the second part, because to be honest, i do not know that much about what is said or not said in any religious
-texts. So, from a legal standpoint, religion really shouldn't even be a factor in this decision, but unfortunately, it is. Government officials refuse to ignore their religion when making decisions. These people should be doing what is best for their country, not for their god or themselves. They should know by now after all the recent gay teen suicides and the amount of bullying that goes on that homosexuality is natural, and not just something made up by people who want more attention. If it was completely made up, why would they continue to act that way after what they are put through. So, if two consenting men or women want to marry each other, why not? It won't hurt anyone and it would make being gay more socially acceptable, reducing teen suicides and bullying.
2. Natural: existing in or formed by nature. As stated multiple times above, homosexuality has been observed numerous times by animals, which, coincidentally, are a part of nature. This means that being gay IS natural. As for people who dislike it on the basis that it's gross, it really is no different from any heterosexual relationship, aside from there being two penises or two vaginas instead of one of each. And
3. I, myself, don't really care if a marriage between two homosexuals is called marriage or not, as long as they have the EXACT same rights as two married heterosexuals. If calling it a union or partnership instead of a marriage helps people accept it, I'm fine with that. And, if you believe gay marriage being legalized will have any effect on the legalization of polyamory/bestiality/pedophilia, I have to completely disagree. Gay marriage is the exact same concept of straight marriage. Polyamory is a completely different thing. It is unknown whether or not three or more people can all love each other and stay in a committed relationship, whereas it is common knowledge that two people can. It would also become an issue with the rights of children and the many laws that would have to change for it to become legal. The relationship between gay marriage and pedophilia and bestiality I don't even see, but some people do, so I'll explain my thoughts. Unlike homosexuality, both pedophilia and bestiality lack the consent of two human adults, so it is illegal and considered
4. Two gay people can love each other just as two straight people can. This is shown by the incredible amount of stories about two women or men that have waited decades by each other's sides just so that they could get married when it was finally legalized in their state or country. There are even more stories like this told by people who personally know two gay people that love each other. Sure, there will be divorces and break ups and cheating, but not any more than there is in heterosexual relationships. I'm sure two people lusting after each other wouldn't stay together for 60+ years.
So yeah, that's my argument. Please excuse any grammatical errors and stuff like that because I didn't read it over at all.
tl;dr? gay marriage equality yay fun good
You can be against gay marriage without hating gays.
If you think it's not hurting anyone, I guess we can have polygamy and even incest marriage then, because you can't stop them from loving who they love, amirite?
Incest can hurt people (mainly, children born of incest). Polygamy is also between consenting adults, so where's the problem there?
Also,
Because one of the main reasons is because it is against Christianity but it actually isn't.
God loves us all and He made us exactly the way he wanted us - gay, straight, bisexual or transgendered, it's His design.
God does not make anyone gay. He loves us all; however, the connection is broken when you choose to go against what His word says. In mortal sin your friendship with God is lost. It's is against Christianity see references below.
That is your opinion about God, as the above comment is mine, and there is no way to prove that either one is right or wrong, but I can't personally imagine a God who would want his homosexual children to be unhappy, feel condemned, and not be able to live their life with the one they love.
Gay marriage should definetly be legal. When it comes down to it, I think everyone has a right to be happy. As long as it is between two consenting adults, I say it should be legal. One of my best friends is gay and it absolutely breaks my heart that, if he wanted to get married to the man of his dreams, he wouldn't have that option.
I think it's extremely unfair to say that just because two people are of the same gender, they can't get married. The main argument against gay marriage is that it is against the bible says it's wrong, but there is supposed to be a separation of church and the state, so I find that to be a completely invalid argument
"The Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion"- John Adams, 1796. Also the only mention of religion in the constitution is "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof" Which is separation of church and state.
In all fairness, that was in the Treaty of Tripoli, which was used to protect them from pirates.
However, we were NOT founded on religious principles. Jefferson was a deist.
Were they not also founded on the principal of escaping persecution?
Yes they were. They were being persecuted for their religious beliefs. We may not be persecuted physically, but some people are mentally. All people who down our comments because of our beliefs are essentially persecuting us.
It's not simply disagreeing it's calling some people stupid or making fun of them for their beliefs. People are telling me to separate my beliefs and my thoughts on this matter. I have the right to state my Catholic beliefs and stand by them.
I was implying that gays not having the right to marry could be considered persecution.
Wasn't the US founded specifically with a separation of church and state?
Yes separation as to state freedom of religion. As everyone is saying times have changed. The founding fathers probably wouldn't dream of some of the things going on with government today. People who had homosexual relations or had relations outside of marriage were normally disowned. It was considered to be unethical. The founding fathers just didn't was another King Henry XIII and Church of England.
Two people in love should be able to be united in marriage. It doesn't matter whether it's a man and a woman, a man and a man, or a woman and a woman; as long as the two parties are fully consenting and it isn't an adult trying to marry a child there is no reason it shouldn't be legal. Homosexuality is found in many different animal species, yet homophobia is only found in ours. Religion should no longer dictate the laws of a country with so many different races, cultures, languages, and beliefs.
I'm gay. I want to be able to get married. Therefor, it should be legal. c;
This is gonna be a long ass report...
This.
I didn't know what I was getting in to.
To me, this question is simple. It didn't ask if I thought gay marriage was right or wrong or unnatural. The death penalty and birth control is against a lot of religions, why aren't those banned? Because when it comes to legal issues, religion doesn't get to have a say.Gay marriage should definitely be legal, because it's a matter of equal rights. All adults can vote, gay or not. All adults can own property, gay or not. And all adults should be able to marry one other adult, gay or not. It doesn't even have to be about love, lots of couples get married for other reasons. It doesn't matter about divorce, or kids, or any of that. Adults gays are a demographic group, and there should be no group that doesn't have rights other groups have. I stress adult because there are people saying if gay marriage is illegal, pedophiles should have the same right. Which is a stupid argument for many reasons, but the legal one being that kids don't have that legal right. Creepy old men want to marry childish 18 year olds, legally go right ahead.
It should be legal because I love my girlfriend and I want to marry her :3
It's a sad day when people are looked down on because they have religious beliefs. All the religious comments are being downed because they don't agree with most of the population. Sometimes I almost feel bad; it's getting harder and harder to stand by Christian beliefs.
My religion is what I believe, and I believe homosexuality is a choice and a sin. I respect you as a human being; however, I don't respect your sexuality choice. Yes they are telling you what you can and cannot do; that is kind of what the Bible does. Yes I know everyone has the right to an opinion which is why I'm curious as to why everyone tells me to shut up. You know what else we have: the freedom of speech. I'm sure you probably are pro-choice too.
You say that homosexuality is a choice. Nobody knows that for sure. I think that it's not, because who would wake up one morning and say, "Hmm, I've decided that I want to be picked on, denied of rights, unable to marry whomever I love, and called a sinner," realistically? I think that being homosexual is not a choice, but rather it is natural and possibly inborn.
Just judging from the responses right here; gays are more supported. Look at Glee for example; everyone who watches the show loves Kurt and Blaine just because they are gay. Yes a sin is a conscious decision. In order for somethingto be classifid as a sin you have to know it's wrong and do it willingly.
And pro-choice has a lot to do with it. You are telling me that it is a basic human right, but if you are pro-choice you are taking the most basic and simple human right away from an unborn child who cannot speak for itself. If you can take the right of life away from someone, then I don't see why it's a problem that I am taking away your right to marry whoever you wish.
Are you gay or straight?
If I were gay do you think I'd be here protesting gay marriage? No I am not gay. According to my Catholic beliefs and the Bible, homosexuality is a sin.
I just asked because to make the assumption about being gay being a choice you would either have to be gay, or have been gay at some point in your life. Sin does not necessarily mean it is a choice. And if it is a choice, it is not a conscious decision. Nurture over nature, ya know?
I just asked because to make the assumption about being gay being a choice you would either have to be gay, or have been gay at some point in your life. Sin does not necessarily mean it is a choice. And if it is a choice, it is not a conscious decision. Nurture over nature, ya know?
I don't look down at anyone because they have religious beliefs. I'm looking down at you because you're PRETENDING to have the same religious beliefs as me. You are using the Bible to make your beliefs seem justified, much like the KKK does.
Despite the term "fundamentalist" which is used to describe people in this category, the fundamental principle of my faith is the Golden Rule spoken by Jesus, the son of God: "Do unto others what you would have them do to you." Making gay marriage illegal would be treating gays differently than we expect ourselves to be treated.
We don't call ourselves CHRISTian because it sounds like a cool name. If you do not believe in the teachings of Jesus Christ, you are not Christian. Period.
I think it should be legal because there's no reason for it not to be legal. If you don't like gay marriage, don't get one. Marriage has a lot of benefits and people shouldn't be deprived of those just because the person they want to marry is a certain gender.
You're probably only downvoted because people didn't watch the video and assumed it was actually anti-gay, not a joke.
Sometimes laws need to be changed based on a changing society. It used to be illegal for a couple to get married if they were different races, but that has changed, because society realised that it was a fucking stupid idea. 12 year old girls used to be able to be married to 40 year old men, but that changed because society realised that it was fucked up and stupid.
Gays are people too and they deserve just as many rights as straight people. Plain and simple.
I was sitting in church today looking at a lesbian couple. They're both older women and they have been together for about 30 years. A couple years ago while same-sex marriage was still legal in California I went to their wedding, but now their marriage is annulled because it's considered illegal. If one of them is sick in the hospital, the other has no say in medical life-changing decisions. There are many other rights that they don't have. I think they deserve to have the same rights as married people because their relationship is more stable than most married people's.
Is it actually annulled? I didn't think it worked that way, but that's fucking terrible.
I know it's no longer recognized by the state, but my church considers them married.
I thought it was that if you're already married you can't take away that marriage, just say that other same-sex couples can't get married. Like, ok they changed the license laws here so that you are on probation for a longer period of time before gaining a full license. However, those who had already legally obtained their licenses weren't put back on probation, just the new people. Does that make sense?
Yeah. I'm not totally sure what happened when it was overturned. I was of the mind that it was annulled, but it sounds like you have more information about it than me.
I think it would be the way I explained, because I don't think you can force a marriage to be annulled. I hope they're still legally married, though.
Yeah, that makes sense. They were really sad when same-sex marriage was overturned, as was the rest of my church.
It upsets me and I'm not even there.
It's funny to me because people say that legalizing same-sex marriage will cause all this crap, like people wanting to marry their pets, and that gays will be hugely public and have gigantic weddings just to show off being gay. That's so stupid. Canada has had legalized same-sex marriage all over since 2005, and it's hardly even talked about here anymore. People just get married the same as ever, with friends and family, not a huge social event. Also, I have yet to hear anyone fighting for the right to marry his dog. That whole argument (irrelevant to anything we were even talking about, sorry) is stupid to me.
I completely agree with you. People are so ridiculous. Another lesbian couple went to Canada to get married because they wanted someone to recognize it.
I know so many lesbians and gay guys and it's never bothered me. It's just like, ok. I'd say just send them all up here, but that doesn't solve the problem and nobody should be forced to leave their home for something as basic as the right to marriage. It just confuses me how the US is said to be this amazingly accepting country, yet they're still arguing over something like this.
Once in 8th grade some kid was like "Why don't all the gay people move to Canada?!" My friend countered back "Looks like you're moving." People here really aren't that accepting. I know there are other parts of the world that are worse, but we could still be a lot better.
I think it eventually will be better. I think I said before that if this post reflects the beliefs of young adults, then it won't be long until things change.
For sure. I give it 12 years max until it becomes legal. By then most young adults who will be voting in the next election or voted in the last one will be raising their kids to be more open minded. And the children who are being raised to be open minded now will get to vote too.
I can't help but feel a little bit superior as a Canadian when it comes to this (sorry) lol. I hope it happens soon, though!
You are superior. America really needs to follow your model. Socially liberal, economically conservative. I really wish we could just find the average American person (who has decent knowledge of economics) in several areas that need funding. We could find wear the money needs to go, stop funding this pointless war so we have more money, and start doing what needs to be done. I feel like we are becoming more accepting though. The difference between the US and Canada is that the US was started with Puritans who were super conservative and Canada was founded by French explorers and settlers who were more open to new ideas.
Well I hope things go better. I mean, the Canadian economy isn't exactly perfect either. But I do think we're better off than the US right now. Things will change, I'm sure.
I went to Canada during the summer and driving back to the US border there was a billboard that said "WARNING! You are now entering an expensive heath-care zone!"
Bahahaha awesome. Know what's weird? I had a way harder time at customs coming back into Canada when I visited the US.
It was harder for me too.. Going back to the US was pretty easy. When I was entering Canada the guy kept asking me tons of weird questions, like why I was only staying for two days and he really wanted to know if I was meeting anyone.
They just really didn't want to let me into Canada because I was travelling with people who weren't my family. They wanted to know why I was with people not my family. It was really weird... Like, my passport is Canadian, so obviously I'm going home.
Customs is really weird.. Like everywhere.
Ah well, such is life.
Absolutely! Everyone has a right to be with who they love, and has a right to be married to the person they love, no matter gay or straight.
Lets look at this from as non-ethical point of view as possible. The population world wide is 7billion and increasing rapidly, we are facing overpopulation. As shown in certain experiments (i can't find the source right now), when rats are placed in a cage they breed until the cage reaches overpopulation, at which point a certain percent of the rats develop homosexual tendencies (among other things). So would it be so bad that this natural phenomenon is taking place to control our exploding population.
From a legal perspective banning it does not make sense. The point of a law is to prevent someone from somehow hurting someone else and to maintain order. Gay marriage does not hurt anyone nor does it cause chaos.
One of the best comments on the page, in my opinion.
I feel like you're cheating...
I have not read all the comments but I would like to state my opinion :)
I think marriage should be a right for all. Many say that marriage is a church thing and therefore should be for "God approved" couples only. I disagree. I think that homosexuals will go to hell if they do not repent (sorry :/) but I think they deserve the same rights as everyone else. Homosexuality is a sin like any other :)
Thank you! Finally someone else who agrees that homosexuality is a sin! I still believe that gay marriage is wrong; however, I never would dislike or treat a person any differently because they're gay.
By not wanting gay people to get married you ARE treating them differently because they're gay.
Hey I don't WANT them to get married. But I still think that it's their right.
Oh that comment was to Mj1996. But I'm glad that you can put aside your own personal opinion and realise that it is their right.
Oh alright :) and thanks!
I think we should not have gay marriage or straight marriage, just marriage. We should change the definition of marriage so that it fits to any two people of any gender, race, etc. as long as the two people are above (or the same age as) the legal age of consent and they love each other there is no reason for anyone to stop their wedding. I've known a lesbian couple almost my entire life and nothing about their relationship is odd or unnatural, they are simply two women who want to spend the rest of their lives with each other. No one has the right to say who you can and cannot marry, and while there is a freedom of speech, it is to an extent. If you can't yell fire in a crowded theater then you can't go up to people telling them that their way of life is wrong. Furthermore, the United States of America is not a theocracy, there is a separation of church and state, so some religious texts, that under no definite circumstances say homosexuality is wrong, have no place in matter so personal.
If two people are in love, they should be able to get married, no matter what gender they are.
It should be legal because the only reason people think it's wrong is because of religion, and religion and lawmaking do not influence one another.
Technically there's nothing wrong with a homosexual couple being together according to Catholic teachings. It's just that they aren't allowed to marry and that they're not allowed to have any type of sex.
(I'm just throwing this out there, I personally think that gay couples should have the right to marry.)
I am for gay marriage for many reasons, but nearly all have already been said above, so I'll just go into depth with the one that has not even been touched on because it's intensely personal to me.
Before I start, I want to make it clear that I, myself, and completely heterosexual, so I really don't want people to start on the "oh you were raised by a gay so you must be gay so obviously you're biased towards gay marriage" thing.
So, I was conceived through sperm donation after my biological mum and my non-biological mum had been together for 16 years, but not married. Because they were not married, they couldn't pay taxes, bills etc. together, (I'm not an expert on the laws surrounding this, but I know it would have been a different situation if they had been married by law, but it was illegal). My non-biological mum is a lawyer and therefore obviously knows a lot more about the laws on taxes etc. than my biological mum. So, during the time they were together, they had an agreement that each month, to cover the bills etc. my biological mum would put half of the money directly into my non-biological mum's bank account and my non-biological mum would send it where it needed to go.
They used this same method to begin a college fund for both my brother and I, but it was in the name of my non-biological mum only. This situation wouldn't have been a problem at all, except for the fact that they split up when I was young, and because of the situation, my biological mum had no right to any of the money whatsoever. My non-biological mum (who now, after all of this I view as a complete stranger to me because of the way that she treated us, though she was once a mother to me) took everything from us, we couldn't even stay in our house. Eventually my mum moved my brother and I to Australia and then to China. Now the fund that they had put together when we were children is finally due for the big pay-out, and my non-biological "mother" has said that we are getting no claim to it whatsoever. My mum is now TERRIFIED about what my brother and I will do for college. Living as a single mother, we had money issues anyway, especially after losing a lot in England, but now she's very very worried. My brother just started college and she's having problems as is, but I'm due to start at a VERY expensive university next year and she won't be able to afford it. If my mothers ha...
had been legally married, the laws would have been different, and we would have had some claim to that money, and my brother's and my education wouldn't suffer as a result.
Now, I know that story was long and probably boring but basically it just explains how the illegality of gay marriage has negatively affected my entire life, EVEN THOUGH I myself am not homosexual. I know that sounds like a very selfish opinion, and it is only one of the reasons why I am for gay marriage, but that's my own personal take on the situation.
As well as this, I would like to add that I have grown up a perfectly "normal" person, and having a lesbian mother has in no way stunted my intellectual, physical or emotional growth.
I personally believe homosexuality is wrong, but I believe that gay marriage should be legal because I don't think the government should be able to tell two adults who they can marry. That is a matter of personal choice, and if that is what they choose then who are the politicians to tell them they can't.
Homosexuality is found in over 1500 species on Earth. Homophobia is found in only one. What seems unnatural now?
In the United States Constitution, it states that all citizens have the right to life, liberty and the persuit of happiness. Homosexuality is natural within the human race. To deny homosexuals their right to get married and live a peaceful, happy life, would be to deny them their human rights. Just because there are more heterosexual people, does not mean that they should have more rights. People should have the right to choose whom they marry, no matter what gender.
You know? Every time two totally obscure people that I dont know and who love each other are happily married, i can't stand it. I mean they love each other! It's so awful. And all gay people kill babies. The bible told me that... or at least thats what Father Rapist told me the bible said.
Also, gay people can't be in the military. They cant shoot straight at all and are much worse at defending our country than straight people because of which gender they are born oriented towards. It has everything to do with the military, you sexual orientation.
In the words of Chris Crocker, "it is not YOUR choice to vote on whether I want to get married.
But, ethics aside, gay marriage could have a lot of positive effects in our modern world. Gay couples cannot have children, so they won't contribute to the overpopulation of the world and are instead likely to take in children who would otherwise have no family.
Also, homosexuality exists and in socially acceptable in many, many cultures in the world. And it has been psychologically proven that there is no correlation between factors such as childhood trauma and homosexuality, making a biological basis much more likely.
It's a right, I don't really care if others do it, it doesn't affect me, but I wouldn't ever do it. That doesn't mean I should restrict their rights.
gay marriage should be legal.
over 44 species of animals have homosexuality as part of their "culture", but only humans get homophobia.
if two people love each other, that's all that should matter.
and does it affect anyone? not really. if 2 gay/lesbian people get married, they cannot have children. so they adopt, usually. that means less parentless children.
i'm a christian, but there are some things in the bible that are outdated. the bible said that eating shellfish is sinful, i don't see every single christian following that. i don't see every single christian staying home and not doing anything on sunday. you can't take everything in the bible literally. and, hate gay people but love everyone? that makes no sense.
also, religion and politics should not influence each other. two completely different fields.
being gay should not influence any part of your life except your sexuality. it should not influence your rights as a human being at all. "and liberty and justice for all," it says, but not really. love who you want to love.
It should be legal because who's business is it but the couple themselves what genders they are? Why should the law be ruled by religious texts? Why should we uphold the parts of the bible that say homosexuality is a sin(Leviticus 18:22) but ignore the parts that say that trimming your beard is an equal sin (Leviticus 19:27)? If the only argument a person has against something like gay marriage is their own personal religion (picking and choosing which parts to believe) then they shouldn't be in the argument.
Love is love.
(My friends and I had this huge talk about this):
If you allow gay people to marry, then the gay bridal registry would help boost the economy. Our country's happiness would boost a little. Gay people then might adopt children from orphanages, which would also stimulate the economy because they have to pay to adopt said children and support them.
Whew! I read ALL of the comments.
Like everyone for gay marriage said above, separation of church and state, unconstitutional, etc. But here's a personal story. Once upon a time, my mom got married, and had two fantabulous kids. Then she decided, "wait. This isn't who I am!" and came out. Through a series of moves, my mom, her partner of eight years and I moved together and are a solid family. I just moved and haven't told anyone about them because I'm afraid of the ridicule that I (and they would) would receive. The end.
This is pretty much the same thing that happened to me. Only I went back and forth between my moms' house and my dad's. Also, my mom and dad remained great friends (think Reba with lesbians instead lol).
If you're ashamed of your family, and if you hide it, you're only perpetuating the belief that there actually is something to be ashamed of. I'm very proud of my whole family (including my aunts and their son) and if anyone asks about my family, I'll tell them.
I go back and forth too. I don't watch Reba :(.
I am proud of them. I told everyone at my old school pretty much the first year. IDK, it's just... idk. I have no legitimate reason.
Haha I don't watch it either, but I know the premise of the show.
People will always be ridiculed, but you shouldn't stand down on your values because someone is an ass. If someone made fun of you because of your nose or something, you wouldn't just accept it and try to hide your nose.
I won't deny that I don't necessarily agree with homosexuality. However, I know nothing about what it's like to be homosexual, and it's probably something people can't help, so who am I to judge?
As a Christian, it is frowned upon in the Bible, but that does NOT mean that we should discriminate against the gays. WBC has it all wrong. So, as long as gays continue existing I'll support their rights because I am not one to deny them what they deserve, even if I'm morally opposed. As a country that offers freedom of religion we need to accept people for who they are and actually embrace the 'all men are created equal' doctrine, despite our occasional disagreements. No more exceptions. The US was built on the fundamentals of freedom, and in order to keep it like that, the people need to support all other groups and lifestyles, no matter how radical they seem.
Jesus tells us to love thy neighbour as thyself. To treat others the way you would want to be treated.
Straight people want to have the right to marry whoever they want, and to join the army, and to avoid discrimination. Therefore, according to the son of God, and therefore the Christian faith, gay people should have all those rights.
Oh also I think there's a different between thinking gay marriage should be legal and thinking it's right. You might think that because the bible says it's wrong that it is wrong but that it's not the bible's place to make the laws and the seperation of church and state should be upheld. (I live in America). I think regardless of what you believe, if you think people have the right to choose to worship god they should have the right to choose whom they marry. Unless you think they should HAVE to worship god which is going against the bible as well
What's with everyone comparing us to animals?
"Only humans get homophobia and there are tons of animals that don't"
Maybe because humans AREN'T animals and are able to have rational THOUGHTS and can SPEAK?
Jeez, I don't hate gays at all but some of this reasoning is just dumb.
Animals might have homophobia.
One time another dog tried humping my dog, and my dog was pissed.
or maybe humans and animals just have a mutual fear of being raped.
yeah its probably the second one.
Humans are animals though.
Yes I do. Not because being gay is natural or because we were born that way, but because we are no worse than heterosexual couples. We deserve the rights granted in marriage because we are equals. There is no difference in a gay couple and a straight couple so why does there need to be a difference in our rights?
I see no problem with gay marriage. We should not allow a straight couple to receive mire benefits just because they're straight. Even if you don't agree with homosexuality, the marriage if a same-sex couple is not going to affect you at all. If two people want to get married, then they should be allowed to, plain and simple. Also, don't get me started on some states'"defense of marriage" laws. They're complete and utter crap.
why are people so touchy about this subject
Well if you want a purely practical reason, think what opening marriage to a whole new large group of people would do for the economy. If you want sentimental reasons, I believe love is love regardless of gender and if two people in love want to get married, why stop them?
Plain and simple: If it's not hurting anybody, then let it be.
The world is overpopulated anyways.
It's legal in Canada, why shouldn't it be in other Countries?
It works really well here too. Pretty much since it was legalized there has been very little talk about it. And apparently some people worry that if you legalize same-sex marriage in the US, it'll make all the gays get big public weddings to cause chaos. Which is just stupid.
If the score on this post is a good indication of the majority opinion, you would think that gay marriage would be legal by now. And I don't know about you guys, but I can't think of a single time that this topic was brought up that the majority of people weren't for gay marriage. So it would seem as though the place where a majority is against it is in our government with the people who get to decide this stuff. So much for democracy.
It's because of the people that make up the majority of the site: age 13-25 and liberal. Unfortunately, the majority of the population is not like this, so they have a different opinion on the subject.
Just give it time, though. If the majority of young people's beliefs reflect this post, it won't be too long before the majority of society does.
It's because old people don't know how to use the internet, and those are the people voting against gay marriage.
hahaha Very true! No offense to old people but there are to many of them that are too opinionated and closed-minded, two things that don't work well together.
Homosexuality is found in over 90 species. Homophobia is only found in one. Which one do you think isn't "natural"?
This has been on this page like, 12 times, hun.
Yes, because obviously I read all 300 something comments
Yes. They're not harming me in any way, shape, or form. What's funny to me is when they'll say the bride may kiss the bride or the groom may kiss the groom. Hehe.
I believe in legalizing gay marriage for what is probably the strangest reason.
I'm Roman Catholic, albeit pretty sucky at it. Yeah, I believe that the whole purpose of sex is to create children and further populate the earth and thus gay sex doesn't fill the purpose and blah blah blah.
BUT
It is your own damn choice whether you do it or not. And you and your partner are the only ones you're dragging down.
No, I don't agree with it. But yes, I think God loves you anyway and I'm going to love you anyway and if for some reason unbeknownst to us mere mortals God decides that you're going to Hell for the crime of loving someone, then who am I to step in the way?
Plus free will isn't exactly free if you're not given the choice to screw up.
If two people are happy together, than leave them the fuck alone. Damn.
As long as the two people love each other, who cares?? It's their personal lives, and we should keep our opinions out of it.
I have honestly never heard one convincing argument in my entire life as to why gay marriage should be illegal. Our nation will be ashamed of ourselves in about 40 years for discriminating so brutally. We should be past this.
wow when i first commented on this i didnt think it would get to be this big
Because people need to fuck off more often, that's why. You're happy, I'm happy, we're both quiet and don't interfere in each other's life. Marriage is more than just religious nowadays; Atheists get married. I don't see what protesting gay marriage does anyway. Seriously, you have fun marrying straight, but what is protesting this lovely couple's love going to do other than piss them off? Seriously, you're just being a pain in the ass.
Some people are really stupid. Just because you're religious, doesn't mean that you shun the homosexual society. I'm religious, and I have nothing against gay marriage. I would never be gay, and I don't exactly support it, but none of that matters, because you should love everyone, whether they be black, white, straight, homosexual, or any other thing! Being gay is not a choice (For MOST). They cannot control who they fall in love with. It just happens how it happens, and that's just the way it is, and the way it always will be. If you don't like them, then shut your mouth. Just live your life, and don't try to change other peoples'. That's rude and annoying, and people will NOT want to be around you if you do that. Keep it to yourself, and leave them alone.
The amount of comments on this post is too damn high!
To the people who are against same-sex marriage based on religion,
1. In the "bible" the act of homosexuality is a sin, not the marriage of the same gender.
2. If you do believe it is a sin, then go ahead and believe it. Sex before marriage is also a sin according to the bible. Did they make sex before marriage illegal? No.
3. The best reason you have against same-sex marriage is because it says it in the bible? I thought the United States has freedom of religion, so why is the bible even in this discussion.
The government shouldn't be allowed to say who can marry who. You should be able to marry whoever you want.
**who can marry whom
I have absolutely no problem with gay marriage! (:
They are people, just like you and me, and just because they like the same sex doesn't mean they are any different. I have a cousin who is gay, and he once brought his partner to a family barbecue and you would never have even known they were gay.
The only homosexuals I don't like are the super obnoxious ones - like the guys who are all dressed up in feathers and sequins and call everyone 'darling' and stuff. It's guys like that that make people against gays ):
The only other thing that pisses me off in terms of homosexuality is when they bring it up, like, "I'm gay" or "I'm bi." We don't go around saying 'I'm straight." do we?
I think it should be legal because it isn't like two gay people choosing to be married is going to hurt anyone. I am also of the opinion that love is love and homosexuality isn't something you choose. Also, assuming you are talking about in America, does our country not promise equality for everybody? Unless they've decided that gays aren't people, I'm preeeeeeety sure that means it should be legal.
Of course it should. The fact that it's not shows that humans have learned very little from history.
Remember when bi-racial marriage was illegal because it was "unnatural", "immoral" and "against the bible"? We're making the same mistakes. Years from now, students in history class are going to stunned that gay marriage was once illegal.
We are not a theocracy. Religion has no place on who has what rights and who can marry who (as long as both parties can give consent).
Why don't they just allow gay 'marriage' but instead of calling it marriage they call it something else but it still acts the same XDDDDD? Some words just shouldn't change their meanings.
lol @ everyone only putting their opinions on the off chance that some person they've never met will cite them in a report
I think it should be legal because it doesn't affect anyone except the 2-3% of Americans it applies to.
I dislike gay marriage because I know that I would have hated growing up with two dads ortwo moms. I'm all for equal rights, but that kid should have the right to grow up with a normal family. Anyone who says they'd be fine with two gay parents needs to re-evaluate their view. Dealing with bullies and people making fun of your two gay parents would suck.
So, what about single-parent families?
It's not so much the not having either a mom or a dad, it's more that you'd be growing up with two of one and none of the other.
What's so different about having two instead of one, other than the fact that having two parents means that you have twice the income and two parents to be doing something at once, therefore, less need of a babysitter?
Also, what kind of a thing is that to teach kids? If we teach kids that having two parents of the same gender is ok, then they won't get bullied. Don't just say it's not ok because kids get bullied about it. Kids get bullied for glasses but we don't let our kids run around half blind because of it.
I grew up with a lesbian mom and her partner. I've turned out quite normal. I had maybe one or two people say something about my mom when she first came out, but outside of that nothing. She was a well respected member of society as a teacher and almost every kid from my high school would tell you she was their favourite.
Also, who are you to say what a "normal" family is? People said the same thing about blacks and white marrying. What a terribly flawed argument.
SAME SAME OMG. Even down to the teacher part!!! Only difference is, my mums split up when I was younger so there was the whole split custody thing which was a bit awkward seeing as by law she had no right to see me as she had no biological connection to me...but she was still my mum kinda...it's complicated...but anyway my brother and mum (biological) and I moved to China so now I don't see my mum's ex-partner anymore anyway...and in China homosexuality is illegal so my mum hasn't come out here (her new long-distance girlfriend comes out here from England to visit quite a bit though, but we tell people she's just a family friend), so no-one knows, they just assume that my mother and biological father divorced when I was little, even though my brother and I were conceived by sperm donation.
Anyyywayyy back to the point...I'm perfectly "normal", and though I'm not 100% sure yet because I'm still young, I'm pretty sure I'm heterosexual so the assumption some people make that if you're raised by gay parents you're going to turn out gay is completely stupid...I'm not quite sure why I've just told you my whole life story haha I guess just because we're in the same boat :P
Yeah. I'm normal. I've actually got a pretty strong sexual identity as straight. However, I can't say that I'll never be with a woman. I'm just not currently attracted to any. But after seeing my mom fall in love, I just won't discount it.
Though, my mom doesn't actually identify as homosexual or bisexual, she identifies as pansexual if anything. My super gay aunts, however, are awesome. You guys should all move to Canada. They've got a son (biologically belonging to one but also legally adopted by the other).
The "it's natural" argument is the weakest argument we have and far too many people seem to use it.
Personally, I think if people will just look at our relations as equal to a modern heterosexual relationship (which would also be considered immoral by many religious people due widespread premarital sex and what not) then it wouldn't really be an issue. I don't care if people call it a sin, I only care when people act like it is inferior or much worse than any other sin. I also don't like when people are against gay marriage because of the bible but are silent on other biblical issues like premarital sex, adultery, divorce, etc.
Doesn't the "it's natural" argument come up because people argue that it isn't? I think both are stupid arguments to make because as human beings we have both natural and unnatural aspects in our lives.
I think whether or not it's natural is irrelevant. People just seem to think natural automatically means good. Though being gay is natural and there is nothing wrong with it, the fact that it's natural is not what makes being gay okay.
Yeah I agree. The "natural" argument is stupid on both sides.
I was just wondering, doesn't all love begin with lust, or at least some form of attraction? Like, no one would ever ask anyone out on a date without at least a little bit of attraction, whether it be to their body or personality. The whole bi-curious thing is a little out there. To be bi you have to like both sexes, but if you have never liked guys and are only attracted to girls then you can't be bi-curious. Most gay people don't even start out curious, they start out a little confused because they don't know why they are feeling the way they are feeling.
Not trying to change your opinion on homosexuality, just trying to show that being gay is legitimate and just the same as being straight (other than than the whole "sin" thing for Christians).
Exactly. Every gay person I know say they knew as long as they can remember. It's like how I've always known I like guys. It's the same thing.
"I also believe that homosexual couples can, in fact, feel true love, although I believe that it begins with a bi-curious lust and develops into it's own sexual orientation"
That seems a lot like how heterosexuality begins. Why do you feel the need to separate the two?
Whether or not it's natural doesn't make it inferior. Now you're using the same argument that you were putting down before, it just happens to work in your favor.
Doesn't all love start out slowly and develop into something real? Like, you don't meet someone and immediately love them. Your relationship starts out slowly and you grow to love one another. I don't see how that's any different from two people of the same gender who fall in love. Could you maybe further explain what you mean?
There is a huge amount of proof that it's not true. Namely, every homosexual who says they've never felt any heterosexual feelings. People generally know they're gay really early. Just because you don't agree with homosexuality doesn't mean you can discount what so many people know they feel.
I agree. Why was this directed at me?
Oooh yeah that bothers me too. I mean, nobody ever says, "Oh well your heterosexuality is just because you were born homosexual but got bi-curious then turned straight!" Because that's not how sexuality works.
Not to mention the scientific evidence:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/scien...nce.psychology
And yes, this next one is a yahoo answers, but the links posted are very interesting: http://answers.yahoo.com/questi...1184811AAXhN3m
Love is free
I tried telling that to that prostitute from yesterday's POTD
I wonder if OP got the necessary opinion.
It doesn't matter if it's natural or not - computers aren't natural, yet here I am, using one. Most of our world is 'unnatural', because we don't hunt and gather, we don't live in caves. Yet there's nothing wrong with technology is there?
And it doesn't matter if gay marriage is against some religions because in the USA and Australia (where I live) as well as several other countries, because in these countries, the government is secular.
It also doesn't matter gays can't reproduce because there's a ton of straight people who can't reproduce and/or don't WANT to have have kids that are allowed to get married.
Honestly, I could go on forever. Every single argument against gay marriage has hardly any logic to it. Those arguments, in my opinion, are based on fear - fear of the unknown. When we don't understand something, we fear it. Fear is the basis of discrimination. Once we get used to something, we don't fear it and problem solved. Gay marriage doesn't hurt anyone, it simply provides a way for gays to express their love. It's not 'contagious', it will not bring the world to anarchy. And at the end of the day, gays are human too. We should never forget that.
That's true. Logic was probably the wrong word to use. I guess what I was trying to say was that, in my opinion, every argument against gay marriage does not seemed to be based on whether gay marriage is ACTUALLY harmful to anyone, but plain ol' fear.
There are always two sides to an argument, but the bottom line for me is "Live and let live."
A person's life is their own life, not yours. It's as simple as that. You can share your views, you can change and control the way you act and think, but if somebody else lives their life differently, that's their choice. You might think that their way of life is wrong, but hey, maybe THEY think that YOUR way of life is wrong. It's all a matter of perspective. It's stupid to try and FORCE someone to think or feel your way.
As such, I personally think that gay marriage should be legal, if it wasn't obvious in the last paragraph.(:
I like something my brother said: marriage for no one, civil unions for everyone.
Marriage is a religious thing, and I think getting the church to accept it isn't really the problem. The problem is that we are denying gay couples to the legal rights that come with it, which is better defined by a civil union.
In other words: I support gay rights, I am just nit-picking over the word 'marriage.' ARE WE CLEAR ON THAT POINT?
Good.
Marriage is not a religious thing. Every culture has some marriage rite.
Granted. But you can't deny that religion has a lot to do with this issue, and I think that completely removing it from that sphere and isolating it to the secular realm would help resolve that.
I agree, religion is the only argument I've ever heard against it. It SHOULD be separate. It shouldn't even be an issue that's put to a public vote. Legal and religious marriages are not the same, and you can easily have one without the other. Therefore, they should be treated as such. No laws are forced upon a religious marriage and no religion should be forced upon a legal marriage.
HA! Look at what Obama's doing to do this country! We now have gays in the army. And now they're thinking of letting transgenders in it too? Homosexuality is wrong, in my opinion. Sorry if you disagree with me, but they're confused. God (and don't comment below saying that God isn't real, okay? Don't even bother because you're not doing any good because I know He's real) didn't design it this way. He designed men and women for a purpose. If He wanted homosexuality, He wouldn't have made the other gender. He probably would've just created men and have them somehow have kids. Gay is 1. awkward (looks like it also) 2. stupid. This may sound a little harsh, but gay people look weird in public. Don't you agree seeing two women holding hands then making out a little... awkward? Hm, I know I do. Or men. Yes, I sure agree with that also. They're just confused (as I said before). And FYI, amirite is made for our opinions, and this is mine.. on gays.
...
The lack of intelligent argument in your comment is repulsive.
You basically just said "Man, damn Obama ruining the army for letting gays fight for our freedom in the war while I sit on my ass bashing them on the internet. Gay people also look weird to me, so they shouldn't have the same rights I do."
Well on the other side of that, God made everyone and everything. For a long time, people who are gay have been made fun of or put down by society. Many people are embarrassed about their homosexuality, refuse to believe that they could be gay and try to fight against it and be straight. They're not "confused" as you say. If they were merely confused they wouldn't have any internal struggles, they would just choose to be straight and that's the end of it. But they can't choose to be straight any more than I can choose to be gay. If they could, you know there would be less gay people in the world because the world isn't exactly making it a safe place for gays to be open about their sexuality, nor are they making it easy for them to have a normal relationship just like everyone else. Being gay is just how they are, and if they can't change that, if that's not something they can help, and God didn't want them to be gay, then they wouldn't be gay. Period. Yet there are gay people in the world. Saying that God doesn't want there to be gay people is like saying that God doesn't want there to be people with blue eyes. They can't help it, God made them that way.
Like Cassowary said, you can't deny people rights on the basis of ew.
Are you gay or straight?
I, for one, do not feel confused. I love my girlfriend. Gays and straights are equals. I have never felt awkward when kissing my girlfriend, and I know how awkward feels so I think I would know if being with her was awkward.
What is so stupid about being gay?
"awkward" is a social construction. I go to a very religious school that EXPELS homosexuals because it's "awkward." In the US, that would be a lawsuit, and it sickens me that they can get away with it in this country. "Awkward" should NEVER be a reason to deny someone of their rights.
It's awkward to me when straight people make out in public. Clearly, we should make straight marriage illegal.
I disagree only because marriage should not be a legal issue.
No dick should ever enter another mans ass...just saying
shitty dick
I'm not against gay people but I'm against gay marriage. Marriage is the constitutions between a male and female and to reproduce, and gay marriage just shames that. You're dating, good for you, but why should you HAVE to get married?
Because marriage grants over 1500 legal rights that gay couples should be able to have as well. Marriage is not just for reproduction, people can reproduce without getting married, and married people can choose to not have children.
Marriage is not a necessity for children, and it's the same the other way around too. No one HAS to get married, but lots of people do because it's a sign of ultimate love, that you're ready to be together for life, that your partner liked it and put a ring on it, etc.
Personally, I think gay marriage should be allowed, although it should not be called marriage. I don't think it should be called marriage because marriage is a religious thing, and religion is anti-gay. (I DO THINK THEY SHOULD HAVE JUST AS MANY RIGHTS AS IN A MARRIAGE) But I'm pro gay rights.
On a side note, how'd you get that italic writing on the bottom?
Other cultures have had secular marriages, but the word marriage that we've taken is from the church. At least that's what I thought, correct me if I'm wrong. I'm not religious so I'm not exactly versed in everything around such things.
Yes, and we should let black people get married too, but just not call it "marriage."
But religion isn't anti-black, is it? Correct me if I'm wrong.
No, but back before black people could marry white people, it was. People quoted the bible as "proof" that black people should remain slaves and that they should not reproduce with white people.
"... the capitalists and slave owners drew on the Bible—which yes, does in fact justify slavery, in both old testament and new..." from http://revcom.us/a/144/BNQ-en.html
I don't have the actual bible quotes used, but I know it was used.
Ah. But the church is still anti-gay, although not anti-black, isn't it? I don't really know, but that's what i thought.
That's my point. The church isn't anti-black people, but they're quoting the bible in the same way now against homosexuality as they once did about black people's rights.
Should atheists and various pagans not get married because they aren't religious?
Well if the religion where the word marriage, or whatever it's counterpart in the language it originated in, was anti-everyone-who-isn't-that-religion, then yes. They can't be married unless that religion allows it.
... You do know that some people just get married by a notary right?
As opposed to i.e. quoting random bible verses as the two newlyweds stare into each other's eyes, they just skip it and say their (secular) vows.
Marriage is seen as more of a legal thing than a religious thing nowadays.
Yeah I know that, in all honesty I've never been to a religious wedding. And I know it's more of a legal thing, but it seems like secular society has just taken a word from the religion that the word originated it and used it it's own way. (FYI I'm not just some guy who's a 100% Bible literalist, anti-gay because of my religion. I'm atheist)
We live in a world where marriage is applicable to irreligious people regardless. Why not let gay people in on the fun?
But isn't religion still anti-gay, and no longer anti-everyone-who's-not-that-religion?
Well, there are plenty of conservative Christians with Islamophobia and other forms of prejudiced hatred, and Al-Qaeda did attack the Twin Towers because of American heretics, and Neo-Nazis/anti-Semites are still a problem, soooo~
And regardless of its origin, marriage is now a legal concept above everything else.
I understand that there are plenty of conservative Christians with Islamophobia,and other such things, but I mean officially. Like, the church isn't officially anti-other religions anymore, I think, and the it still is officially anti-gay.
Doesn't change the fact that marriage is secular.
But marriage isn't secular, it's from Christianity, isn't it? At least the specific word marriage, translated from whatever it's origin was, Latin or whatever.
It never really even came from Christianity per se, the concept dates back into prehistory.
I know the concept does. But the concept would include civil unions, etc. Marriage, specifically, did.
But married people get certain benefits involving taxes and the like. I'm pretty sure that neither one of us live in a theocracy, so the government can't exactly be doing this for their god.
As such, Civil Unions should have the same benefits as a marriage. I'm not saying it should be a theocracy, because I think it should be like that around the world, seeing as Religion invented the specific union known as marriage, and religion is anti-gay, therefore it'd be kind of dumb to basically steal the word.
Nope. Getting all caught up in semantical nonsense in all this just ruins everything. Marriage has evolved. It's that simple.
Oh yeah, cuz the whole "separate but equal" thing always works...
My feeling on this is that they should have a different ceremony that's political but separate from religion so they get all the benefits but the religious ones.
It's mostly religious people opposing it though. And hardly any religions want to allow it.
It's mostly religious people opposing it though. And hardly any religions want to allow it.
Because since when has it been wrong to love someone.
All the people talking about equal rights are probably the ones that are pro-choice. Does that unborn baby not count and not get any rights? If you can say that, then I can say gay marriage is wrong.
Can you really call yourself pro-life though? Most political conservative Christians tend to be Republicans, and the Republican party doesn't favor many benefits such as healthcare and welfare in order to make those post-fetus lives better.
And if the fetus you protect is gay, would you keep fighting for its rights?
And I know this isn't relevant, but since you got to jump to conclusions and go off on tangents, why shouldn't I?
im pro gay rights AND pro life
wooo
Same.
But it's not the church's decision. The church should have no say, and religious people should exclude their beliefs when voting for things like this. It shouldn't matter if you support gay marriage because of religion, or don't because of religion when it comes to voting. Vote with the Constitution, morals, and the Bill of Rights in mind, not with Jesus, Messiah, and Allah.
I don't think there should even be a vote.
Morals? I am voting according to my Christian morals. It is stupid to tell me not to vote with Jesus and Allah, which is the Arabic word for God. My religion is my life if I separated it, I would be 2 different people. I pray each morning for God to work in me, through me, and with me. That is also telling me I don't have the rights to practice and carry out my Catholic beliefs.
We live in a secular society. Your religious beliefs should not be used to prevent other people from living their lives the way they see fit. You, of course, don't have to get a gay marriage if you don't want to.
My homosexuality is MY life, and it disgusts me that you're trying to take it away because of your beliefs. I'm not trying to end Christianity, so don't try to prevent gay marriage. You have rights to practice your religion, and I SHOULD have rights to marry whoever I want. Its not a one-way street, and if you get your Christian rights, I should get my gay rights.
I understand if you are against a religious same-sex marriage, but are you against the legal right to same-sex marriage? Nobody wants to force the church to marry people they don't believe should be married.
I don't agree with the bible
It's simply not the way things were meant to be. A century ago (not even, actually) people were expected to marry the opposite sex. Period. But now, with "human rights" flashing around society everywhere, gay people have begun coming out of their shadows and demanding the right of marriage. Really, the only love is the natural bondage of sexual drive. Sometimes, people mistake their thinking of "that person is quite attractive" to mean that they love that person, regardless if they are of the same sex. If you are male and see another man as being sexy, it doesn't mean that you are gay, it just means that you noticed their attractive features. There's a difference, but people tend to not notice that line. I support the church all the way, but that doesn't mean I'm not tolerant of gays. Just not their marriage.
I love how you put "human rights" in quotation marks, like it's this laughable new-age thing.
"Damn those kids with their newfangled human rights and women's suffrage and electronic hip-hop!"
Yes. Government conspiracies all the way! Haha
wth was that..
Homosexuality has been around since the beginning of humanity (at least, as far back as any documentation can reach we know it has existed). Long before people were "expected to marry the opposite sex," homosexuality was around. Hell, look at the Spartans: those men were pretty much always screwing men.
You are wrong that a person can't be attracted to someone of the same sex the same way that you are attracted to someone of the opposite sex. Read this line from Wikipedia:
"In 2006, the American Psychological Association, American Psychiatric Association, and National Association of Social Workers stated in an Amicus Brief presented to the Supreme Court of the State of California: 'Gay men and lesbians form stable, committed relationships that are equivalent to heterosexual relationships in essential respects.'"
It's obvious that you have misinformed opinions about homosexuality, namely that true homosexuality doesn't actually exist and gay people are just confused about their attractions. Just know that your position has already been thoroughly debunked by scientific research time and time again.
I believe that love is just a chemical reaction in the brain. That really it is just natures way of tricking us into reproducing. That love doesn't really exist. I don't think that makes it any less relevant.
What if I want to marry a woman I love? Can you really tell me what I feel or don't feel?
Since we are both straight, we are really in no position to understand the feelings of gay people and the nature of homosexuality.
Of course, you're right in that totally straight people can think people of their same gender are sexy/hot. That's totally normal. A straight person can even have a small crush on someone of the same gender. That's pretty common too.
But being a homosexual, as I'm told, is totally different. Any gay person will tell you that their love is just as strong, pure, and true as the romantic love of straight people.
What if it's more than just an attraction? What if it really is love? Gay people can love each other just like straight people.
The only reason I voted no, is because the term "gay marriage" is a contradiction.
. the state of being united to a person of the opposite sex as husband or wife in a consensual and contractual relationship recognized by law"
in the dictionary, the word "marriage" is defined as: "marriage
however, I believe that gay people should be able to be unionized whenever and wherever they want to, as well as have it recognized by law, and have all the same rights. It should just be called something different. Either that, or change the definition of marriage.
I think we should change the definition of marriage. If I was gay, I wouldn't want to be unionized with my partner, I'd want to be married. But I never thought of it this way.
Yeah, I feel that way, too. Maybe changing the dictionary actually would be beneficial.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sa...iage_in_Canada
Canada did and it worked out quite well.
that thumbs down was supposed to just be an "n" in parentheses, indicating that it's a noun. haha.
If we allow gay marriage, then we must also allow polygamy and maybe even marriage between animals and humans, but definitely polygamy. It also makes marriage mean less, just like divorce, because there's no other reason gays want to marry other than tax and government reasons. They can still love without getting married.
WHAT? NO OTHER REASON THAN TAX AND GOVERNMENT REASONS?
People can't marry for love now, huh?
You can love each other, have a party and such to celebrate, but marriage is there for tax and government reasons, yes.
Well then no one should get married. Your argument is invalid.
So then why don't we rule out marriage all together? There's no reason a straight couple want to get married other than tax and government reasons according to your logic, amirite? And an animal is not a consenting adult.
I'm straight and if you aren't religious then yes, the only point of marriage is for tax reasons. I however am religious and therefore my reason for getting marriage is so that I will not be sinning when I have sex with the woman I love.
And why do straight couples want to get married?
There are plenty reasons for gays to marry other that "tax and government reasons"
If you're not married and some life-threatening accident happened to your partner, the hospital will most likely not let you visit them. Which would affect gays. How would you feel if you're girlfriend or boyfriend had an accident and you couldn't even visit them because you're not family or not married.
An animal can NOT consent. So no, we would not have any reason to legalize beastiality.
As for polygamy, I personally am not partial to it, but what business is it of yours if a few people are ok with marrying the same person? Consenting adults should be able to define their relationships on their own terms.
Straight people can be in love without getting married as well.
Also, gay marriage is the union of two CONSENTING people. In an animal/human marriage, how would the animal be able to give consent?
http://amirite.net/637940
Why is it absurd?
That's exactly what people say about same-sex couples. So what if YOU believe YOU shouldn't marry more than one person. If three consenting adults want to enter into a legal marriage, they should have as much right to as two people of the opposite sex (and two people of the same-sex should also have this right).
Well I'm a very strong Catholic and the Church doesn't allow it because the purpose of marriage in the Catholic Church is for reproduction. Gay couples cannot reproduce. I do accept the fact that they exist and I'm okay with it, but I'm with the Church on this one.
So then should straight people who are physically incapable of reproducing be banned from marriage?
Well, that's not what the sacrament is for. I'm with what the Church says and no one can change that. I'm not going to change my view on things when I firmly believe in because it's not the popular opinion.
I may be wrong here, but can't the pope change that? They (popes) have changed other things haven't they?
I'm just wondering because I'm not catholic, and i wouldn't really know.
No. There's this thing "Tradition" (with a capital T) and it's stuff we believe in since the beginning of the church. I'm simplifying it a lot because it is way more complicated. Overall, no, the pope cannot.
So, you follow the church, not the bible?
The Bible is what ultimately offends against it actually. I found this article on http://www.gotquestions.org/gay-marriage.html. It explains everything and provides evidence IN THE BIBLE about homosexuality and marriage. There isn't enough room to post the entire article, but check in Leviticus 18:22, Romans 1:26-27, and First Corinthians 6:9 for direct information on homosexuality and thoughts. Whenever marriage is mentioned in the Bible, it is only mentioned as between and man and a woman. This article even addresses modern science discoveries. I'm not against gay people. I go to a Catholic school and with gay people. It's not uncommon in my school. I respect them, but I'm not changing my faith or apologizing for my ideas.
OK. I see that (going by the bible) your opinion about gays are valid, but not about marriage.
You said the reason gays cannot marry is because they cannot reproduce, also stating that a man and a woman that cannot reproduce together should not be married. Instead, the only validity I see is that (again, according to the bible) gays cannot marry because they are gay, not because they cannot reproduce.
So, straight couples that cannot reproduce can marry. Am I wrong?
Well yeah, but getting into that is a whole other topic which is more complicated than everyone is making it right now. It's what the church says ultimately which I believe in. I'm only a 16 year old girl in a Catholic high school, not a priest. I wish I could do more explaining but I don't know much more about the topic other than God made woman for man and man for woman. I respect gay people, some of them are my absolute best friends and the sweetest people I have ever met in my life. It's just what my faith is and I stick by it. Freedom of religion.
If it wasn't the "popular opinion," wouldn't same-sex marriage be legalized by now?
So you have never had sex for the sole purpose of entertainment? Sounds like bullshit.
You say the Catholic Church doesn't allow gay marriage. So? It also doesn't allow pre-marital sex and many catholics, possibly including yourself, are guilty of that.
I have not had sex yet because I am not married. I am a very strong Catholic, as I said before. Other people aren't, but the OP wanted my opinion.
People who are very dedicated to their religion do not have sex for the purpose of entertainment. In their eyes, sex is a way to reproduce, because that is what God wants and blah blah blah. I completely and totally agree that it is bullshit, but the bible or the church or whatever claims that's the purpose of sex and it should not be for any other reason.
Not my belief, but for some people it is.
Nobody has a problem with the Catholic Church not allowing gay marriage in the Catholic Church. The Catholic Church is a private organization that can define the sacrament of matrimony anyway it likes.
People do have a problem with the government not allowing gay marriage any where in the country. The government should only restrict behavior that is dangerous or harmful to society. Two people of the same gender getting married and raising a family is in no way dangerous or harmful to society so the government shouldn't be allowed to restrict it.
Legal marriage and the sacrament of matrimony are not the same thing. It's one thing to believe that the holy sacrament of marriage should not extend to same-sex couples because it is against God's law, but denying a group of people the basic civil right of a legal marriage is a whole different issue.
Marriage in the eyes of the Law is not the same as Marriage in the eyes of God
I agree. They are two seperate things, that being said I think that they should be called something different. They should have the same legal rights but I also think that the church should be more strict about who they let get married. I think that they should exclude anyone known to fornicate, people who had an illegitimate divorce, and people of the same sex.
I think same-sex marriage and opposite-sex marriage need to have the same name. I feel like calling same-sex marriage something else like a "civil union" would make it seem like it's a second-rate, inferior version of marriage. I don't like that idea because it implies that full legal marriage is a special privilege for straight people and not a civil right.
I don't think gays should get a legal partnership equivalent to marriage, I think they should get regular marriage, just like straight people.
No no, they should let gays have civil unions. Blacks too, they don't deserve a "real" marriage. [/sarcasm]
I'm not saying that marriage is straight and that civil union is gay. What I'm saying is marriage is from the church and civil union from the state. Non religious people, homosexuals, and people with illegitimate divorces would have civil unions. Strait religious people, and if the church allows it, anyone else, would have a marriage. But the choice is up to the church.
NOT EVERYONES CATHOLIC
and i'm catholic and im TOTALLY fine with gay marriage and think it should be legal
you have a failure of an argument
He said why YOU said what you said. I said "No Way" because I'm Catholic. Not because everyone else isn't.
so you think it should be illegal for gay people to marry just because you're catholic?.....
Yes. I am a strong believer in what they say, because I AM A VERY STRONG CATHOLIC. Very strong. You're just going to have to deal with the fact that there are people in this world who have religious values and I am one of them. There will ALWAYS be people against your opinions.
why does it affect you if 2 gay guys got married? oh wait it doesn't.
keep your religious beliefs out of peoples personal lives.
I have religious values too. IM CATHOLIC TOO. i'm just fine with 2 gay people getting married that's all....
But if it was strictly a religious sacrament, then you wouldn't need any legal documents for it to be a legitimate marriage. If you want a religious marriage you go to a church. But you can get married legally without a church. They're two different things.
Legal marriage IS a government institution. That's my point, it would have nothing to do with your religion or church or whatever.
The whole point is that gay people should be able to LEGALLY get married. That's what this issue is, that same-sex couples can't get the legal benefits of marriage. I don't care whether or not your church marries two men, it's irrelevant.
Ok but that document is what the argument of same-sex marriage is about. The argument is about the legal government marriage. So what your saying is neither here nor there.
Ok, so just call what the argument is about "the issue of legal same-sex marriage." What do you think of that? Of same-sex couples deserving (or not deserving) the same legal rights of opposite-sex couples?
So you do believe same-sex couples should have the same legal rights as legally married opposite-sex couples. You just don't consider that "marriage" a marriage?
Ok but legal marriage isn't the same thing as religious marriage. They're different things entirely. So differentiate between the two. I don't believe any religious group should be forced to marry two people they don't believe should be married.
Fornication as in sex outside of marriage or also including sex within marriage had without the intention of making babies (i.e., using birth control)?
Ok, that makes sense. I wasn't trying to be rude btw, I was genuinely curious. Sorry if I came off that way.
Ah, good.
Weather or not they are married they're still wasting seed. Being married doesn't make them anymore sinners than they already are. Just wondering, are you ok with it if they don't get married by the church but by the state? Also, I don't think your comment should be voted down because that is your religious belief, it's not like you said "eww queers homofags yucky gross unnatural".
I just agree with the Church. The sacrament is to reproduce and they cannot.
There are almost 7,000,000,000 people on this planet. I don't think it would be horribly detrimental for some people not to reproduce. In fact,both of my uncles are married to women and they don't want to have kids.
You totally ignored the question above about infertile people getting married. If your only issue with it is that they can't reproduce, then by that logic, you should be against infertile people getting married. I'm not trying to be mean, I'm simply trying to understand your logic.
Also, as colebowl said, would you be ok if it were legalized by the state and no church need perform such marriages?
So you do not believe in using birth control?
Of course they dont. You arent supposed to have sex until marriage anyways, in their eyes.
Married people use birth control.
What does marriage have to do with birth control?
No, that's against my beliefs because it is having sexual relations still.
Sexual relations just means having sex. You're even against married people having sex? Wow... You're super Catholic.
Yes, it is true that they may not be able to "reproduce" but they can adopt like many same-sex couples have already. Giving a child who does not have a home to two people that love each other is great!
We live in a secular society. What a religious institution says about gay marriage shouldn't affect its legality.
But not everyone is Catholic. There are people who have no religion, and have no problems with anyone. Gay people are born gay, blacks born blacks, whites born whites. So why should a straight couple be able to marry and divorce as they please, but a gay couple can't?
But I am. He asked for why I said "No Way" not why other people would.
You're right, he did ask, and I shouldn't argue about your opinion. But I don't think religion should have a say in laws. Catholic or Atheist or Jewish or Muslim, religion should play no part in politics.
But how is that fair to them? Isn't it God who has a plan for everyone? Why would he plan for some people to be homosexual? It would be his doing, so why should be deny them the right to get married?
That's a good question.
Maybe because it's not in his plan for them to be married. Sure, God created gay people, and he loves them, and he has certain plans for them, too. You could ask, why does God create some women who are unable to have children, or make some people singers and others tone deaf? Maybe that woman's life plan does not involve children, or maybe God wants that singer to sing the word and the tone deaf person to just speak it. Who knows?
I do no believe in the Catholic religion but I do go to a Catholic school, and this is what I'm taught in religion. Being gay is something that needs to be overcome with prayer and and God's help. God says it's okay to have gay thoughts, but not actions. If you think that God has a plan for everyone, then it is reasonable to think that God made a person gay to see if they could stay dedicated to their faith and to God. It's God's way of challenging a person and seeing if they can ignore temptation. Just like any other temptation is put in front of us.
I repeat, I do not believe in all this, but if God has a plan for everyone, you also need to realize God doesn't make things smooth sailing for anyone. He expects you to ask for help when you are born that way. Catholics think being gay is something you can fix.
Wow, I have never thought of that reason. You bring up an excellent possibility. I'm a Catholic too, but I support homosexuals. I guess we'll only find out what the real reason is when we leave this world :)
Men. I do not believe that God made anyone gay. I would guess that his plan was for then to be celebrated and living in such a sexual relationship oriented world, when they weren't attracted to women they thought something was wrong with them so they turn to men. That or they get made fun of for being gay to such an extent that they start to believe it themselves.
Yeah well I'm also Catholic and the main purpose isn't for reproduction.
I don't think it should. It's just not natural.
Homosexuality is totally natural. Other animals do it. And out of all the species that do have homosexual members, we are the only species that judge and look down on them. Sounds like we're the unnatural ones for thinking being gay is unnatural.
Eating your young hurts the young. Gay marriage only hurts you if you're a sadomasochist.
If that's your point, I agree, but the whole "natural" argument is used because people who oppose gay marriage use the "unnatural" argument. The "natural" argument is a rebuttal.
Exactly how does the unnatural argument make sense?
Other species are just as intelligent as ours, only in different ways. Can you survive in the wild only eating bugs and LIKE it? Can you swallow an animal full and not choke? It's survival skills, but it's intelligent and we sure as hell can't do it!
umm since when are humans highly intellectual
The difference between homosexuality and the examples you gave is that homosexuality is natural to humans. We are not adopting a trait. We are arguing about a trait of that comes naturally to some of own people.
Prove to me that feelings come natural to a human being first
Yes, we can prove it's natural to humans. It's been documented in the brain, in addition to the fact that, uhh, there are people naturally gay. It's not like they just randomly chose to be gay. So it's natural to them.
Natural is occurring in nature, that is, without artificial involvement. They are, therefore, naturally gay, so it's natural to humans. You can argue various points past that, but the argument over if it's natural shouldn't even exist.
Actually, I don't have a problem with cannibalism, as long as the person consents to being eaten. That being said, cannibalism harms people. Gay marriage does not.
Homosexuality might be natural for many animal species. But as humans, we are not animals! God created us and He isn't a homo nor an animal so neither are we.
And someone HAD to tie in religion here...
a couple years ago, my family had a gay cow. it's natural.
A male dog will hump anything, including male cats, legs, and houseplants.
You forgot pillows.
Oh yes, and pillows of any gender.
I'd like to know your thoughts on hair colour, implants, make up, artificial fur or leather, plastic flowers, aquariums, artificial jewelry, grass carpets, wigs, artificial limbs, pacemaker, artificial sweeteners, fake plants...
My point is, if we made everything unnatural illegal, we'd be going back to stone age.
Hair color is natural. Changing it isn't.
Marriage isn't natural either. It doesn't come from nature.
You cant say that. Clearly you havent beses of all the people who have killed themselves because they got teased about being a homosexual. If our society doesn't accept it,how so you expect our youth to?
it's not natural to dye our hair, it's not natural, random crap on our faces to enchance our beuty isn't natural, putting a battery in your body to keep you from having a heart attack isn't natural, wearing clothing isn't natural, sitting on a piece of porcelain to "releive ouselves" isn't natural, yet you choose to hate on homosexuality?
well, honestly, some people are allowed marrying their pets. So if you're allowed marrying a dog, you should be allowed marrying a human of the same gender...
Obviously it is if it's happening with not just humans, but other animals too.
thank you for your opinion. I'm on the fence about it.