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"You can't have 100% security and also then have 100% privacy..." Barack Hussein Obama Izherite?

The exact quote can be heard in Part 1 of the link provided. Do you believe Obama truly welcomes debate on a topic that was a secret to most Americans until just a few days ago? And can there really be a debate when officials refuse to answer questions and provide the details or information necessary for all people to know and be fully aware of what is happening?

Obama on NSA: 'Nobody Is Listening to Your Phone Calls'President Obama promised Americans that "nobody is listening to your phone calls" as he defended the need for the NSA to monitor the phone records of Americans.http://foxnewsinsider.com/2013/06/07/obama-nsa-nobody-listening-your-phone-calls
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freespeechfreelancers avatar People & Celebrities
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I think the deciding question is:
Does it actually help stop terrorist attacks?
If so, I think any other motive behind it probably isn't harmful enough to us to make it not worthwhile.
If not, then there must be another motive, and it's likely not good for us.

@Watchful_questioneer I think the deciding question is: Does it actually help stop terrorist attacks? If so, I think any other motive...

If you are paying close attention to the various governmental scandals occurring right now, it is pretty certain that the motives and end results are NOT good for us. And regarding terrorists - once we get them, we do nothing with them. We put them in a cell and never get around to trying or punishing them. So all Americans are being conditioned to ACCEPT the fact that we should lose all our privacy and freedoms over potential or actual terrorists who make a mockery and joke of our legal system. Nadal Hasan (Ft. Hood terrorist) is still untried after more than 2 years, and his crime was called a "workplace violence" action, not an act of terrorism (and he still collects his monthly paycheck). The Boston Marathon bomber is not doing anything and you hardly even hear a word about him now. And of course the big one - Guantanamo Bay. Still open and not a single man there has been tried for anything. It is actually a disgrace and insult to watch our government "in action."

@freespeechfreelancer If you are paying close attention to the various governmental scandals occurring right now, it is pretty certain...

You make a good point- but it's their rights being infringed, not ours (not that that's any better). The thing is, it's better to catch real terrorists and not deal with them properly than to not catch them at all, especially when it doesn't seem to come at any great cost to the American people (we like privacy, but what use is it when there's absolutely no harm in losing some?). There are still real terrorists out there, and I think that without stuff like this, they'd be able to do a lot more.

@Watchful_questioneer You make a good point- but it's their rights being infringed, not ours (not that that's any better). The thing is...

Check the story out a little more carefully. They are collecting data on ALL OF US - not just suspected terrorists. We are being thrown in to the same collective pool as the bad guys just in case they MIGHT need information down the road. It is similar and equivalent in my mind to illegal search and seizure. Just because I drive by a police officer in my car, he is not supposed to be able to suspect that I have drugs or alcohol in my car, pull me over on the assumption, and then actually search my vehicle. The problem with today's government is - they are treating all law abiding citizens as potential criminals, bad guys, and terrorists. Look what a person has to go through to get on a plane now. Every American is treated like they may be carrying a bomb. I still maintain that the average American would not know what a bomb looked like if they saw one, or how to make one. If the government was truly targeting and going after ONLY terrorists, then fine. But they are really lumping us all in to the same big category and assuming we are all guilty of something before we have ever done anything. If you can live with that rationale, be my guest. I can not.

@freespeechfreelancer Check the story out a little more carefully. They are collecting data on ALL OF US - not just suspected terrorists...

I agree that they're treating us like this, but I think if they didn't, terrorists would have a much easier time finding ways to hurt us. The search and seizure part is (in my opinion) bad just because of the waste of time for us, and the inconvenience. However, it doesn't inconvenience us online. I ask again, how can it possibly harm us?

@Watchful_questioneer I agree that they're treating us like this, but I think if they didn't, terrorists would have a much easier time...

How is there possibly ANY right to privacy if they are allowed to gather all possible data regarding us? What does privacy mean? If you want them to know all of this, again, fine by me. I don't think it is any of their business. Right now, without a warrant, they CAN listen to any phone conversation you may be having, and they can read any text message, email, or anything posted on your social sites. And all this without "probable cause." The Patriot Act (which I hate) made this possible. In other words, they can assume you are guilty and treat you as such, and worry about proving it AFTER the fact. That is how much things have changed and why so many are outraged.

@Watchful_questioneer But what bad can come of it if i truly have done nothing wrong?

See, they have taken hold of you already. The fact that you have NOT done anything wrong, means you are law abiding and not criminal. You are entitled to full rights of freedom and privacy. By allowing them to have everything about us up front (just in case they need it), is giving them the upper hand and taking our privacy away. They do not need to know (or have access to) what I am saying in every letter, email, phone call, picture I take, and on and on. It is none of their damn business. Most teens don't even want their parents to know this much about them, but seem to have no problem now allowing government in on every aspect of their lives.
And what does ANY of their collection of such about law abiding citizens have to do with catching the ACTUAL TERRORISTS? You are not one, I am not one, and the majority of Americans are not.

@freespeechfreelancer See, they have taken hold of you already. The fact that you have NOT done anything wrong, means you are law abiding...

It's a precaution. Someone is, and when they find out who is likely to be, they want to have info at their disposal.

I'm questioning the necessity of the right to privacy in general, because I don't see the worth of it. Maybe I need to think more about that, but I just don't see what bad it does to me.

@Watchful_questioneer It's a precaution. Someone is, and when they find out who is likely to be, they want to have info at their...

Please do some more thinking and reading about what our rights to privacy are/were all about. Privacy is a staple to our freedom and liberty. And one other thing for you to consider - do YOU have the same access to THEIR information and personal details as they have to yours? Hell, we can't even get our President to release his college transcripts. Your premise of saying YOU have done nothing wrong as a basis for you not minding them knowing everything should equally apply to all in authority, control, and power. But our leader does exactly the opposite and either invokes the Executive privilege or has documents permanently sealed. So what is HE trying to hide?

@freespeechfreelancer Please do some more thinking and reading about what our rights to privacy are/were all about. Privacy is a staple...

Then the problem is that we don't have the same access to knowledge they have over us, not the amount of knowledge about us at their disposal.

The thing is, privacy is valuable because you can keep harmless secrets that you don't want people to know because they're embarrassing, not illegal, and the government doesn't care about embarrassing. What use is there for it? And as for illegal, it's probably best that they know of it, then.

I didn't bother to watch the video so I don't knkw the context, but I do agree with the original statement in the post.

"A society that chooses to sacrifice some of its freedom for some more security deserves neither, and ends up losing both." (loosely translated)

Don't agree completely, just wanted to say I played Civilization IV =)
(although I know the quote is from someone else).

Those who sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither.--Benjamin Franklin

I think our founding father says it well.

Who ever said security was the higher priority value??

Shay80s avatar Shay80 Disagree -1Reply
@Shay80 Who ever said security was the higher priority value??

Not I. Freedom and liberty FIRST............any day. I think we could do a better job defending ourselves than our government claims it is trying to do. They can't even figure out how to close and secure our borders for God's sake.

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