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The 'things' you perceive are not things at all. They are a collection of possibilities each with different probabilities. Do not make the mistake of assuming anything you perceive is just as it seems.

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VicZincs avatar Technology
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Our eyes are the result of millions of years of natural selection. Mutations which gave an advantage to survival have been favored, so human eyesight is not a be all end all solution. Instead we are left with the eyesight evolution has given us. As most know, eagles have superior visual acuity and bees can see light that is outside the visible spectrum of humans.

In addition, our eyes only detect colors and shapes. Our brains then take this input and give it meaning. In all likelihood we all probably perceive things a little differently one from another. This is true for all our senses.

So when we perceive things, we are seeing them through our own "lens". It is not a matter of correctness, but it is a limitation.

@PhilboydStudge Our eyes are the result of millions of years of natural selection. Mutations which gave an advantage to survival...

It is indeed a limitation, that's why we develop instruments to detect things we cannot directly perceive.

Hmm... I wonder what color a bee sees when it observes something in the ultraviolet? biggrin smilie

A good example of this is that the World's greatest scientists continue to be proven wrong in medicine, astronomy, etc...

@JerryHendrickson By other scientists.

And that's how progress is made. The alternative is trusting in things that can't be falsified, usually involve the supernatural.

Yes, Vic, and some possibilities are so remote that you can neglect them, especially if the more significant possibilities pose a danger to you.

That's why you wouldn't jump off a 10-story building.

@VicZinc We finally agree. What took you so long?

What took ME so long?

What took YOU so long (as if I didn't know)? biggrin smilie

@Thinkerbell What took ME so long? What took YOU so long (as if I didn't know)?

I have been saying it all along! Nothing is true.

I could jump off a building and not die. It is not "the truth" that I would die. It is probable - but it is not 'true.' Nothing is 'true'.

You finally agree with me! Yes! What took you so long to come to your senses?

@VicZinc I have been saying it all along! Nothing is true. I could jump off a building and not die. It is not "the...

"NOTHING is true"?

It's not even true that it's probable that you would die, as you just admitted?

Another day, another self-contradiction by Vic. Maybe Superman will rescue you. biggrin smilie
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@Thinkerbell "NOTHING is true"? It's not even true that it's probable that you would die, as you just admitted? Another day...

Of course it is not 'true'.

It is probable that I am right.

It is not 'true' that it is probable that I would die, it is probable that it is probable I would die.

How the heck would I know how probable the probability of dying is?

I mean let's say someone (like me) says there is a 99.99% probability of dying. Now I might think there is such a probability, and there is a probability (say 98.7%) that I actually do think that, but I might be lying.

On the other hand let's say a super brilliant person such as yourself actually calculated the probability that I would die. Your calculation is probably accurate, being that you are probably as bright as you think I think you are, but it is not 'true' that you are, or even that I think you think you are, probably.

It is not even true I said that it is probable I would die. It is probable that you think I said it, and I probably did. But maybe I didn't, it's somewhat probable that I was lying.

I had you, then lost you.
Oh well. We will probably get to try this another day, maybe.

@VicZinc Of course it is not 'true'. It is probable that I am right. It is not 'true' that it is probable that I would...

I don't have to calculate an exact probability that you will die. You merely said it was probable, and that is a true statement.

Or I could make a weaker statement that even Vic the nihilist could not quibble with (without further self-contradiction, that is): it is true that the chances of your being killed in such a fall are not zero. biggrin smilie

@VicZinc In what sense true?

In the very same sense as your quibble.

Since you correctly claimed that the chances of your dying as the result of a fall off the top of a 10-story building are not exactly 100%, I likewise correctly claim that your chances of dying in such circumstances are not exactly zero.

Elementary, my dear Watson. biggrin smilie

@Thinkerbell In the very same sense as your quibble. Since you correctly claimed that the chances of your dying as the result...

You seem confused.

How do you know that I am right? How do you know that chances of your dying as the result of a fall off the top of a 10-story building are not exactly 100%? They might be. No one knows.

Likewise you don't know that "[the] chances of dying in such circumstances are not exactly zero." They might be exactly!

I have a lot of respect for you, but it just seems folly to claim they you know these things to be true or false.

@VicZinc You seem confused. How do you know that I am right? How do you know that chances of your dying as the result of a...

I know both of these statements are true because

1. There have been some people who have survived such falls, so the probability of being killed can't be exactly 100%.

2. There have been many people who haven't survived such falls, so the probability of being killed can't be exactly zero.

Yeah, yeah, Vic, I know, how do I know the black swan isn't a figment of my imagination? biggrin smilie

@VicZinc Exactly

Yes, and we may all be characters in a hyper-dimensional video game too. biggrin smilie

As I have pointed out to you before, life is too short for ridiculously remote possibilities. biggrin smilie biggrin smilie

@VicZinc You sure are spending a lot of time on them.

ME, Kemo Sabe?

You're the one who keeps insisting we can't rule them out. biggrin smilie

@VicZinc Takes two to tango. Thanks for the dance, I'll have another.

No doubt, you will, with some equally far-fetched, self-contradictory quibble. biggrin smilie

@Thinkerbell I don't have to calculate an exact probability that you will die. You merely said it was probable, and that is a...

"nihilist " - Perfect word!
Thank you for teaching me, again!
I appreciate smart people such as yourself!

I wonder if there is a cure for Nihilism - or if we're gonna have to ... Oh wait, you guys already have scientific proof Vic is checking out. Never mind!

@Budwick "nihilist " - Perfect word! Thank you for teaching me, again! I appreciate smart people such as yourself! I...

There is no cure for nihilism, short of jumping off a 10-story building, literally or figuratively.

Nihilists have done that many times. biggrin smilie

@VicZinc As opposed to a "leap of faith" I suppose.

Leaps of faith can indeed have their drawbacks. biggrin smilie
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@VicZinc Simon was far from a nihilist.

Of course he was far from a nihilist...

I posted this scene as an example of a leap of faith with unpleasant consequences for the leaper.

I liked his Zentai suit with the sperm cell pattern, however. biggrin smilie

@Budwick "nihilist " - Perfect word! Thank you for teaching me, again! I appreciate smart people such as yourself! I...

You act like nihilism is silly? Then you wonder why some people think "faith" is silly.

Both seem like reasonable ways of being a human to me. As good as any.

@VicZinc You act like nihilism is silly? Then you wonder why some people think "faith" is silly. Both seem like...

Nihilism - the rejection of all religious and moral principles, often in the belief that life is meaningless.

I had never heard the word before yesterday. I looked it up and it was like a puzzle piece that fit my understanding of you like a glove. I was amazed. I had no idea that it was so common that they actually had a word that encapsulated the whole package.

I don't think there's anything silly about nihilism. I do think it's profoundly sad however. I can't imagine what life is like - so empty and meaningless.

You seem to have found a way to deal with it though and you are satisfied, so good for you.

@Budwick Nihilism - the rejection of all religious and moral principles, often in the belief that life is meaningless. I...

Actual very happy and satisfied. Interestingly I assume the opposite, believing in 'stuff' seems sad to me.

@Budwick Nihilism - the rejection of all religious and moral principles, often in the belief that life is meaningless. I...

Naah... Vic just does it to annoy people who don't see through his little game.

He knows perfectly well that it is extremely unlikely for him to survive unhurt if he jumps off a 10-story building.

That's why he won't do it. biggrin smilie

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