+312 Why do we religious people (NOT just Christians) use a book (or something similar) to justify so many things that hurt people? It is a belief, and I am sorry to say that we have absolutely no proof besides our faith of it being anything but a fairytale. I am not saying believing in a religion is wrong, I am saying that unless you can prove its existence don't involve it in other peoples' lives.... amirite?

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Prepare yourself. The haters will be here soon.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Lol.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

I don't think people purposely involve others in it... The only way they'd be able to not involve others is by keeping themselves secluded from the rest of the world... It's what we do as people- we share our ideas/thoughts with others...

by Anonymous 13 years ago

I realize that fully excluding it is not realistic. But does that mean that it is right?

by Anonymous 13 years ago

I dunno if it's right but I don't think it's wrong... But then again, I'm not exactly sure what thing(s) you're talking about... I'm a Christian and I never use the Bible to hurt anyone- I don't see how I could... As long as I'm following what's being said.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

I guess it depends on our interpretation of the word "harm". To me it means both indirect/direct emotional/physical harm. If you are against gay marriage because of the bible that is fine. But saying that gays are going to hell and that when they die God laughs (like the Westboro Baptist Church says) is most definitely harming people, both straight and gay alike. I'm personally focusing on the issues involving homosexuality but I'm sure they apply in many other cases. At least as far as keeping it our of peoples' lives I meant things like gay marriage, anything that we are doing in our countries should not be influenced by religion...idk. I was just saying a post that I think it true. I'm tired and am having a hard time thinking of examples right now.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

*cue the dramatic entrance of Scrantoncity and his lackey Phil_the_Minion*

by Anonymous 13 years ago

I love how famous they are. Whenever something religious comes up it's like, "Oh, prepare yourselves! Here they come!"

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Thanks. *Sprints in double backflip 180* *fails*

by Anonymous 13 years ago

finally

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Well, in religion, the text IS our truth. You must believe it to be a part of that religion. Most of us don't try to force our views on others, but if they are brought up, we defend them. And if you weren't allowed to say things that didn't hurt someone somewhere, there would be no communication whatsoever.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Bravo!

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Absolutely.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Because thats's too logical.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Because Christian religions say if you're not spreading the word and trying to convert people, you don't care enough. "Faith without works is dead" is how the cliché goes, I believe. It's crap, and obviously a way to gain power, but there it is.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Jesus prompoted a humble life, so if people were real christians, they wouldn't be out for power like that. Again, people are bashing Christianity about converting people. The rule of Islam when it comes to non-muslims is convert, banish, or kill them. And I've met some missionaries and they truly believe God has touched their lives and want to share it with others. Dont' get me wrong, they are kind of annoying sometimes, especially when they dont' stop smiling but just say something awkward and maybe they'll leave you alone. Once I asked a couple of mormons about somethng really gross that happened in the Bible and they looked like they were ready to bolt.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Actually Islam is an extremely humble and peaceful religion and it is required in their laws that they must help people including strangers and hungry. The exact opposite of "convert, banish, or kill them".

by Anonymous 13 years ago

That verse doesn't relate to converting people (which shouldn't be the objective of the church in the first place). It's about showing God's unconditional love; not one with strings attached of a lifetime membership to something. Some people just decided converting people is easier than being God's love cause they don't understand it themselves.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

I'm a christian, yet i don't evangelize because i feel that I was not blessed with the gift of sharing. Instead I show my faith through my actions. Works do not necessarily mean evangelization.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

If you HONESTLY want to help "spread the word" about your religion, just do that door-to-door "Want to hear about god's story?" crap that people used to do. Sure, it's old-fashioned and crap, but at least people who don't want to listen to that stuff can just say no.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

People still do that. We get Jehovah's witnesses and Mormons sometimes. I've met missionaries that went to foreign countries that had little knowledge of Christianity to spread the word there.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Yeah, and I'm honestly not pissed at them at all. I forgot what kind of people did that. Thanks for telling me. :) But anyways, I'd rather simply say "no thank you" to someone asking me to hear them out rather than get the whole religious lecture shoved down my throat.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Wow! No negative comments on a homepage post about religion! This must be a record!

by Anonymous 13 years ago

unbelievable

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Because I am a Christian, I am going to generalize this and respond with things I think to be true from the Bible There is actually a lot of truth in the Bible... I recommend reading Lee Strobel's book The Case For Christ, he was a an atheist reporter turned Christian... Time and again people have thought historical acts in the Bible were untrue but surprisingly often it has been true. I do not believe the Bible should be used to harm anyone. "hate the sin, not the sinner". Also, pertaining to westboro baptist "church"... they are not affiliated with any Baptist or Christian organization. Few people in the American body of believers agree with what they do, and how they do it.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Wow...look at all these really long comments from people who think they're automatically gonna change the poster's mind. I agree with this post. I believe religion..but I need some proof first. So, you're right. Thanks for the post!

by Anonymous 13 years ago

OMG this is what I've been trying to explain to people. Religion is A BELIEF!! You shouldn't try to force your religion on others, when it is your personal belief. This is why I am so against Jehovah's Witnesses... Leave everyone alone and let them believe or learn about what ever THEY want!

by Anonymous 13 years ago

presumably you're writing from a first world country, in which no one really forces religion on you anymore. save modern totalitarian governments, which force atheism (regardless of the fact that it is 'the lack of religion', it must be mentioned as relative to forcing beliefs on another). to be forceful is not the same as to force. how does one know what they want to believe or learn without first knowing what there is to want? without guidance one just forms an imbalanced set of statements in their head, which are potentially dangerous because people are usually illogical

by Anonymous 13 years ago

It is true that from BIRTH, the parents should teach (or whatever the situation should be) the CHILDREN what to believe. But adults fighting amongst each other about religion or trying to force on others (who can make their own decisions) is wrong. So basically one should be taught what an authority believes, but once he/she knows the facts, they should decide for themselves.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

the point is that people can't know the facts the way people are raised gives them bias and know what facts? there honestly aren't many solid facts aside from the historical when discussing religion. most of it is conjecture and interpretation based on religious text

by Anonymous 13 years ago

The way people are raised gives them bias that THEY should be able to change once they know the "facts", and when I say facts I mean religious "facts", whether true or not.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

you... realize that changing someone else's or your own bias isn't very practical? because everyone is disinclined to believe the things that you tell them are wrong about them

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Listen, I hate discussing religion. You haven't changed my mind, I haven't changed your mind. We have our own opinions on things. I'm done discussing this, agreed?

by Anonymous 13 years ago

we're not really discussing religion anymore. at this point, we're discussing changing other peoples' opinions. also, look bias!

by Anonymous 13 years ago

"look bias!" I don't understand what you mean.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

you view argument as a source of frustration, while i don't view this as an argument at all. moreso as a bouncing of ideas off of one another. 'course thats probably just because i attempted to refute your initial comment

by Anonymous 13 years ago

To all who replied to my previous comment; I understand evangelism isn't the only form "works" can take. However, you can't deny that the bible specifically states that people should spread the word and encourage others to get baptized, and that's all I was saying. And to the person who mentioned islam... I certainly don't think they're any better. I used christianity as an example, since it's the predominant religion on this site.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

you have to question a book where God tells a man, who had waited for a son for so many years, to go kill his son, just to prove his loyalty....

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Fangirl92, you are an idiot. Those are islamic EXTREMISTS. Every religion has its extremists. Islam's a peaceful religion actually, just that it got overshadowed by the extremists. Seriously, they wouldn't ask you to convert or anything until you're fully ready to go to THEM.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Hey Soren, riddle me this: you're saying religion of any kind should be verifiable fact? Well, why don't you take a look at evolution. Because that sure hasn't Been proved, it IS a religion, and it justifies racism, the thought being that black people are less evolved; more apelike. THAT is definitely infinitely worse than condemning some choice, like premarital sex, or homosexuality.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

You know nothing about evolution. Because of evolution, black people are genetically superior in sports. Does that sound racist? I don't think so. Being gay is not a choice, I would know. I've decided you're just a troll out to insult anyone unlike you, and since I won our last argument I'll win this one too so I won't even bother with you anymore. I'm not troll food.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Actually, in "On the Origin of Species," Darwin says that it is beneficial to kill any of those that are weak to the development of the species, including humans. And because there is no definite empirical evidence of evolution it is also "just a belief," in the same way religions are since concrete evidence is lacking for both sides. And saying one ethnicity is better than the other is racist, not just if it's degrading to black people.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

I know nothing? First off natural selection wouldn't affect your ability to play sports. Not even close. At least know why you're arguing. Why don't we look at the facts, Hun. According to evolution, out of Africa some 600,000 years ago, man evolved to be more capable with tools. Supposedly, it was like Homo Habilis (fake) homo erectus (also fake) homo sapiens. However, ignoring the invalidity of all this, you may seem to realize that the (forged) fossils slowly begin to resemble modern (white) man. And when you compare the skull of a black person, it more closely resembles the (false) homo erectus. Now, you did bring up an interesting point; why are we less adequate than gorillas and stuff? Huh?

by Anonymous 13 years ago

I never said anything about evolution being true. And yes, it hasn't been proved to be true. So, while it is not wrong to believe in it, just don't use it as an argument.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Also though, the vast majority of people who believe in evolution don't use it to hurt others. Sure some might say things like african americans are more apelike whatever but I do not believe that.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Well the vast majority of Christians don't believe gays are inferior, but some believe homosexuality is a sin... So your argument is worthless. Most muslims aren't terrorists, yet some still intend to murder Christian Americans.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

(scrantoncity):Rational people who beleive in evolution arn't racist because they beleive that diffrent races have developed characteristics to help them better survive in their environment. Just like rational Christians arn't racist even though the KKK base their beleifs off "Christianity". Because some insane extremist evolutionists are racist doesn't mean that most of them are.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

The evidence for evolution is forged? Funny, I could say the same thing about Christianity and no one could prove me wrong. At least evolution has more than a book to back it up. So there are some holes? There's holes in the bible too. They're equally credible, I just choose what I think makes more sense than just saying, "God did it."

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Woops never saw you replied. Funny thing is, almost all the "evidence" for evolution is forged or inconclusive. Go ahead; give me what you believe to be the best case/evidence for evolution. This is your one chance to present an argument. Because thus far, You haven't said anything except "Oh well there's proof!!"

by Anonymous 13 years ago

You seem to base so much off of evidence, yet you talk about the bible...seems kind of hypocritical to me.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

What? I mean what are you saying; the Bible is factually inadequate? I wouldn't have any problem with evolution having lack of evidence if A: it weren't taught like a Gospel Truth in schools, B: idiots actually understood it isn't proven, or even close to being proven, or C: If my tax dollars didn't fund that religion being taught in Public Schools.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

it is a belief, not a religion.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Tell me; is it scientifically factual, or are they assuming things impossible to know, and therefore, prove, making it require faith in unknowable, hypothetical situations, thus making it a religion. Or at the very least, a hypothesis and By no means a scientifically valid theory.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Religion is the belief of a god existing. Look at the definition. I said it is a BELIEF which means that it has not been proven s'not cannot be. You are putting words into my mouth. When did I say it was a valid scientific theory? Never. I just said that it has more evidence behind it than the bible.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

I meant "or not "s'not". Damn phone.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Okay; I'll pose the same question on you as I did pikabeau. Give me some evidence. Solid, factual data that isn't explained just as well with creation. Also, atheism is a religion. What's that one where they worship nature? What about Wiccan?

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Can I give you an exact answer to our creation? No. Want to know why, because nobody has any clue what actually happened. You have gone way off topic with my post. My post said, unless you can prove it is true, don't use it in an argument, or in a decision that affects others. Yet we still use things like the bible in a lot of these decisions even though we cannot prove that any of it is true. Second, why are you bringing random religions like Atheism and Wicca into this? I never said anything about them. Neither did you. You just randomly said "Also, atheism is a religion. What's that one where they worship nature? What about Wiccan?" What were you trying to bring up?????

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Sorry; maybe I wasn't clear. You said "Religion is the belief of a god existing." Which is completely false, and an utter failure. So, I gave three (or two cuz I didn't know the name of one) examples that showed how wrong you were. Relevant? Yes. In regards to your post, evolution hasn't been proven, nor will it ever be, for it is speculation, with no science (in the strictest sense of the word) at all. However, do people use that, the belief that this is all we have, have fun, to justify their actions? Heck yes they do. Heck yes. Did you know that teen pregnancy and teen suicide Have increased twentyfold since 1940? And what variable do you think caused this; the lack of moral fiber caused by Darwinian evolution's lies, or some other obscure reason you'll try to validate to yourself?

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Why should I give you proof when all you will do is tell me my evidence is made up? You're too close minded to accept anything that contradicts what you believe, so even when there is proof, you call it lies. Transitional fossils seems like good enough proof, but you'll just tell me someone created them. There is proof that the Earth is way more than 6 thousand years old, but you will call that proof flawed. Can you give me proof that your religion is right without using your bible? I doubt it. The bible has a number of contradictions anyway.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

You're just incapable of making a good argument. It's funny that you keep calling me "close-minded" but is it really close minded when you're the one with the better argument? Or is that being smart? Transitional fossils don't exist, actually. They are fabricated evidence. Research it. If you don't believe me, research it. The scientists found the top of a skull (hmm it looked *exactly* like a modern human) and ran some "tests" (namely just dated them, which is already flawed) and, using that as conclusive evidence, they felt they had the authority to construct an entire, baseless half-man guy. They have no clue as to what the faces look like. For all we know, that was four different humans which the fossils came from. It's utterly preposterous that the scientific community tolerates such lies.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Half-ape* not half-man, though i suppose that'd work too.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

According to creationism, it all started with Adam and Eve, right? That means that there could only be a maximum of two races of people if evolution was not true. If you look around, you can plainly see that not everyone looks the same. That is evolution. I'm still waiting on you to give me evidence for creationism.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

What you just described is, in fact a TYPE of evolution: microevolution. Also known as variance, or adaptation. This is indisputable, for it's true, and you can witness it. That has nothing to do with macroevolution: the change of one species to another, as the theory of evolution is based on. Once again, a null point. That's like saying if you switch out say, a lightbulb in a house it'll become a whole new house. It's ridiculous and speculative. Want evidence? Okay. You never asked, or at least I must've missed where you did. "In fact, evolution became in a sense a scientific religion; almost all scientists have accepted it, and many are prepared to 'bend' their observations to fit with it.". Hmm this seems to be interesting. There are only two options for our world; either it was created by intelligent means, or unintelligent. Those are the only two options. Now, the probability for unintelligent means is less than 1/ 10^35. That number is so huge, i...

by Anonymous 13 years ago

It'd need the earth's area just to write down the zeroes. Intelligent design is the only option.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

You're just pulling numbers out from thin air. I never said intelligent design was wrong, I said your version of intelligent design was. You know, the one in the bible. It is likely that their is a god, but the chances of it being the god you worship are slim. An intelligent designer could have designed all organisms to evolve. What you don't seem to understand is that over time, microevolution becomes macroevolution. Macroevolution doesn't happen over night. It takes millions of years. Stop skirting around it and give me proof your bible is right.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

What you don't seem to understand is, over time, microevolution DOESN'T become macro. Tell me; is there *any* evidence for this? No? Dont present it as truth, then. Well, if evolution never happened, then there is no chance any deity did that. How bout this? Since modern science validates the rest of Genesis, isn't it logical to say since most of it is correct that the one thing that can be neither proven nor disproved would be also? Hmm?

by Anonymous 13 years ago

What modern science proves genesis to be true? Most modern science says the big bang is true and that the earth is billions of years old. You're so good at calling everyone else wrong without basis, but when it comes to proving yourself right you fail miserably.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Agreed!

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Question: do you know anything? No really; do you know anything? I'm completely serious. Do you know anything? Because quite honestly, you don't seem to. Modern science is grasping at straws. So much has been disproved, so they're forced into an utterly indefensible, preposterous, STUPID position. Nothing created everything? There is, quite honestly, NO evidence supporting this, NO logical, physical, or metaphysical way this is possible, and NO reason at all for this theory to exist, other than public need to fulfill their sinful nature, trying to alleviate the guilt of their actions by convincing themselves that no god exists.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

If God created everything--then how was God created? He was just there? That is pretty much the same as believing that the world popped up out of nothing.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Believe it or not, buddy, your beloved science negates your argument that the universe existed forever. However, if you want to argue that point, I'd be glad to explain to you how you are wrong. Yeah, supposing, for one instant, that an all-powerful deity exists (not technically all-powerful; there are few things God can't do), wouldn't he be able to transcend time? Whether or not you close your mind to Him, if you suppose for a second He exists, He would be able to transcend time.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

I never said nothing created everything. I said your specific religion is wrong. I agree, something must have created us, just not your god. You have yet to give me proof for your religion, which is all I ask for. I repeat, proof for your specific religion.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

"What modern science proves genesis to be true? Most modern science says the big bang is true and that the earth is billions of years old." Hmm and yet you "never said nothing created everything."?? Honestly, you either intentionally disregard half my comment and focus on one thing, or you're incapable of forming an argument to match mine. Why? You have yet to give me proof of evolution, even though you said " Most modern science says the big bang is true and that the earth is billions of years old." I never said I had proof for my religion. However, when modern science, when not disregarded by the scientists because it contradicts their beliefs, shows evidence for a whole earth flood, history shows the validity of some events in Genesis, and mathematics gives us reason to believe the earth is under 20,000 years old, I'd say that's pretty much a good argument for why my religion is correct. So go ahead; show me proof of evolution. You said it was p...

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Well, sorry that I gave one of the dictionary definition. A better one is: "A set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, esp. when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs." So, evolution is NOT a religion. Now, I have said, like three times that evolution HAS NOT did you hear me? I'll repeat it. HAS NOT been proven. Now, leaving THAT behind us yes people DO use it but SHOULD they NO. Am I saying that people are going to leave behind religion/unproven beliefs etc. when making decisions involving others? No. Realistically they are not going to, but SHOULD they? Probably.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

"Did you know that teen pregnancy and teen suicide Have increased twentyfold since 1940? And what variable do you think caused this; the lack of moral fiber caused by Darwinian evolution's lies, or some other obscure reason you'll try to validate to yourself?" Okay, maybe, MAYBE Darwin's beliefs (NOT lies--you have yet to prove they are false, hence they are not lies.) have caused some increase in suicide, but really? "We evolved!" "Omg I'ma go kill myself now." Don't think that happens. So although I supposed that may play a factor in suicides it is undoubtably not the only reason people commit suicide--you may not have meant that, but it sounded like it. I think that things like depression, bullying, family problems (i.e. divorce, parents go to jail, etc.), and things like that are a WAY bigger reason people commit suicide that evolution. If I totally butchered what you meant--I am sorry, but that is what I felt like you meant.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

I have given you my proof, you just called it lies. You keep asking for proof yet you have no proof. All you've said is science agrees with you. You've never said what science or what experiments agree with you. I have given you fossil evidence. You even admitted microevolution is true, but you refuse to accept that microevolution turns into macroevolution. Why should I argue with you when I have proof, but you don't? You've even resulted to insults. I'm sorry, but you have the makings of a terrible debator.

by Anonymous 13 years ago

Oh remember my first comment? Told you so...

by Anonymous 12 years ago