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If the Westboro Church can protest at funerals and call it free speech, then why can't people in the military tell others that they are gay? Does being in the military take away your freedom of speech and freedom of expression? amirite?

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@694392

Then either:
A) Those bigots should be the ones kicked out.
B) Those people should still have the OPTION to say that they are gay.

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@696984

sorry. I meant to say that if they beat up a gay person they should be kicked out.

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@695324

We should really make an exception for funerals and such.. that is just sickening.

mchristies avatar mchristie Yeah You Are 0Reply

It's perfectly acceptable for the military to ask soldiers not to discuss their sex lives at work. If you walked around your job flaunting your sex life, you'd likely get reprimanded for it. It's fine if a soldier is gaythey should be supported just as any other soldier would bebut the military is a workplace. It's inappropriate for anyone to talk about their sex lives at work, whether gay or straight.

@RunnerGirl It's perfectly acceptable for the military to ask soldiers not to discuss their sex lives at work. If you walked...

Keep in mind, saying "I'm gay" isn't the same as saying "Let me describe to you the first time i had sex with another man". But you have a point.

ClaireTheBozos avatar ClaireTheBozo Yeah You Are +1Reply
@ClaireTheBozo Keep in mind, saying "I'm gay" isn't the same as saying "Let me describe to you the first time i had sex with...

This is true. But where in normal conversation would this even come up? No one asks; no one tells. I think it's a good policy that keeps everyone's rights in mind.

@RunnerGirl This is true. But where in normal conversation would this even come up? No one asks; no one tells. I think it's a...

Well I don't really understand why someone would march in and say "HEY EVERYONE I'M GAY LOL" but i can imagine that guys will delve into their sex lives eventually, and at one point or another, a guy will say that they're gay.

ClaireTheBozos avatar ClaireTheBozo Yeah You Are 0Reply
@RunnerGirl It's perfectly acceptable for the military to ask soldiers not to discuss their sex lives at work. If you walked...

It would come up when people ask if you are married. Like, "Are you married?" No. I have a partner. "Have you ever dated any hot girls?" No. I've dated hot guys though. "Don't you think that soldier chick over there is hot?" Honestly no. I do, however think that guy over there is hot.

Change the pronouns if said gay person is a lesbian.

Enough examples for you?

They just made it so that you can join the military if you are openly gay.

Anonymous +2Reply

Then if idiot homophobes assault gays, they should be punished. People shouldn't have to live in secret. I agree flaunting any sexuality in the workplace is unprofessional and ill-advised, but having to lie about your whole life(what if you live on post? Are you supposed to have no love life, ever?) is ridiculous.

Anonymous +2Reply
@Then if idiot homophobes assault gays, they should be punished. People shouldn't have to live in secret. I agree...

I'm pretty sure homosexual acts are an abomination anyways, least of all during a stint in another country.

Don't Ask Don't Tell. They can't ask you, you can't tell them. It's really NOT that complicated.

@scrantoncity I'm pretty sure homosexual acts are an abomination anyways, least of all during a stint in another country. Don't...

And it'd work great if no one ever asked, but it comes up, it does, I guess i want to know why it should rest on the gay guy's shoulder's to abide by the rule, even though the others that talk to him about it are breaking the same rule? Why aren't they ousted for asking? I mean, it's not like these gay guys just up and say "Hey, I'm gay" I wouldn't think that they would want to bring up the topic themselves, do you?

(Not trying to start or fuel an arguement, please don't take it that way, I'm just making a calm, honest inquisition.)

@scrantoncity I'm pretty sure homosexual acts are an abomination anyways, least of all during a stint in another country. Don't...

They don't have to ask directly for the subject to come up. People shouldn't be forced to lie to hide their sexuality if they do not want to.

Scrantoncity..."what is the problem? That they can't show off to their friends about their giant stretched rear? That's disgusting."

What the FUCK is wrong with you??? Who says that sort of shit? How incredibly ignorant can you be?

Anonymous +1Reply

I like how you didn't reply to my comment. You claim to be such a devote Christian and yet you say shit like that. You're the biggest fucking hypocrite on this website and I don't even need to choose reply because you know exactly who I'm talking to.

Anonymous +1Reply

My history teacher was talking about this a few weeks ago. I found it quite depressing. To know our society is this low. I find it so wrong that these people are able to do that...

Anonymous 0Reply

Scrantoncity is right riled up about this...

Anyways, perhaps it's the motive behind discharge that we should question. Is it right for a man to get discharged because he's a homosexual, and would like get attacked by the vehemently pro-manly army? Perhaps. Is it right for him to discharged because the discharger (maybe not a word) didn't like gays? No.

OR we could ask: Why did this guy feel the need to express himself so? I for one, don't hate gays, but hate the flamers who act feminine just to associate with "gay culture". If I ran a military, and had some pansy wearing short shorts, I would definitely tell him to go. But if someone was gay? No. Why would it matter to me?

Perhaps none of that made sense, but I guess what I meant to say is: Why is it even an issue? Someone in the military should act accordingly, and their sexuality shouldn't come into play. Flamers should GTFO, but as for plain homosexuals? Who gives a shit?

hortators avatar hortator Yeah You Are 0Reply

if you join the military, you sign a contract. in addition to that contract, you are governed by a seperateset of rules: the UCMJ (Universal Code of Military Justice). Alot of the Constitutional rights are represented in the UCMJ, while others are edited or left out. I am in the military so i know whati'm getting ino here. but think of it this way: the military is similar to any other job in thisway: if you don't like it, THE DON'T JOIN IT!

So, you would expect to be able to cuss out your boss without repercussions just because the first amendment? No. It's called rules. Rules are in place for a reason, and if you break the rules you're getting kicked out of the military.

@scrantoncity So, you would expect to be able to cuss out your boss without repercussions just because the first amendment? No...

When the Commander in cheif of our military, most if not all four star generals, the overwhelming majority of Americans, and the commander of allied forces in the middle east all think that the rule is bad, then it's probably time for a change.

BreakfastFans avatar BreakfastFan Yeah You Are +5Reply
@BreakfastFan When the Commander in cheif of our military, most if not all four star generals, the overwhelming majority of...

The Commander in chief just HAPPENS to be a liberal. The "overwhelming majority" of Americans is really only a slight majority, and sense when has majority been automatically correct?

Tell me exactly WHY it's bad. Go for it. Don't say it's discriminatory, for it isn't. Tell me why we should let the homophobic men in the army know who is gay, and wreak havoc upon those gays.

@scrantoncity The Commander in chief just HAPPENS to be a liberal. The "overwhelming majority" of Americans is really only a...

Because if a homosexual is known to be in the military, they get fucking discharged. That's incredibly discriminatory. If they want to be open about their sexuality, they should be able to do so without risking their careers. You don't see any heterosexuals losing their jobs because their commander has found out about their sexuality. Yeah, it sucks that a bunch of homophobic idiots would attack gays in the military, but homosexuals shouldn't lose their chance to serve their country because of their sexuality. That's fucking stupid. If anything, those that are openly homophobic should lose their jobs. They're the ones causing problems, not the gays.

Resokus avatar Resoku Yeah You Are +4Reply
@Resoku Because if a homosexual is known to be in the military, they get fucking discharged. That's incredibly...

As far as I know, there is no way to determine someone's opinion without outright asking them. It's really not that bad. While you're serving your country, you can be darn sure the other men don't need to know about the other's homosexuality. I wouldn't WANT to know the person behind me in the shower is gay. I'd rather he keep that information to himself. Which really isn't that hard.

It also isn't discriminatory, or wasn't, because they were expelled for breaking a rule. That may be an excuse, but Don't Ask Don't Tell didn't cause discrimination.

In short, are gays too stupid to keep their mouth shut? Is that what you are suggesting? THAT'S discriminatory. I am more than confident that they are fully capable of following Don't Ask Don't Tell.

@scrantoncity As far as I know, there is no way to determine someone's opinion without outright asking them. It's really not that...

They can go through their e-mails and ask their family and shit. If they find out they're probably gay.. they kick them out.

The law is flawed.

mchristies avatar mchristie Yeah You Are +4Reply
@mchristie They can go through their e-mails and ask their family and shit. If they find out they're probably gay.. they kick...

But they're NOT GOING to go through their emails and shit hence the "don't ask" part of the don't ask don't tell. I'm in the military and its not that bad. I mean you shouldn't share info at all with your coworkers about your sex life anyway so who cares. The law isn't saying you can't be gay its just saying if you are we don't want to hear about it. shrugs

Anonymous 0Reply
@mchristie They can go through their e-mails and ask their family and shit. If they find out they're probably gay.. they kick...

Hmm, Evidence? Whether or not this is true, it's corrupted, and not part of "Don't Ask Don't Tell."

@scrantoncity As far as I know, there is no way to determine someone's opinion without outright asking them. It's really not that...

That's not what I'm saying at all. I served four years in the reserves. In AIT, a kid got discharged because our sergeants believed he was gay. Why? because he had a lilt in his voice, like the stereotypical gay on a TV show has. He never openly admitted that he was until after he was discharged, but because it was assumed that he was, he was discharged. And you're right on one point. You don't need to know about another's homosexuality. But you don't need to know about ANYONE'S sexuality at all in the military. But heterosexuals will sit there and talk about their sex live, usually all guys, all day long. Unfortunately, the military isn't like any other job, where you work with your co-workers and go home at the end of the night, ignorant of whatever they may be doing or whatever is going on in their lives. You live with the people you work with in the military. People will at some point or another, be exactly who they are. And others will talk.

Resokus avatar Resoku Yeah You Are +2Reply
@Resoku That's not what I'm saying at all. I served four years in the reserves. In AIT, a kid got discharged because our...

Yeah, just avoid the topic. That's kinda the whole point of "Don't Ask Don't Tell." If they ask you just laugh it off and say you're not much of a player. Do whatever you have to. I'm sure their intelligent enough to get out of a situation like that.

@scrantoncity Yeah, just avoid the topic. That's kinda the whole point of "Don't Ask Don't Tell." If they ask you just laugh it...

That's not how it works. Imagine if roles were reversed and you had to play it off. Could you pretend you love sucking dick and taking it in the ass just to keep your job? And that's not even the point. The problem is NOT with the homosexuals in the military. It's with the homophobes that attack gays, and the inequality of the entire DADT law. If DADT were to remain, it should be so that ANYONE who is open about their sexuality AT ALL is discharged. There's nothing right about discharging someone just because of their sexuality. In the civilian world, you can't get fired because of your sexuality, and you can't be denied work because of your sexuality. Why should you be in the military?

Resokus avatar Resoku Yeah You Are +2Reply
@Resoku That's not how it works. Imagine if roles were reversed and you had to play it off. Could you pretend you love...

Oh, that's a good argument. Not.

How about saying I'll avoid the topic all together? Like I suggested? Just laugh it off, or just say "I had bad experiences, and don't wanna talk about it." Would that work? Most definitely.

Okay, so you're saying that if the gays left the military, the problem would remain, the homophobes would just stir up other trouble? Hmm. That's logically sound.

DADT was a compromise. Gays are free to serve in the military; what is the problem? That they can't show off to their friends about their giant stretched rear? That's disgusting. They have just as many rights as the straight guy. They can go out, defend our country valiantly, and be thought highly of. Why would it be so hard to sacrifice sex for that? Huh? Then don't enlist. If you don't have the self-control to abstain for a few months, don't enlist.

Gays shouldn't be kicked out for just being gay. However, breaking DADT, yes, they should.

@scrantoncity Oh, that's a good argument. Not. How about saying I'll avoid the topic all together? Like I suggested? Just laugh...

just saying, the guy aforementioned was kicked out under the assumption he was gay. Granted, that guy never said he was gay, and that's not how the system SHOULD work, that's how it's happening.

I see where you're coming from though, I do. If the system were implemented the way it should be, then yeah, I guess there wouldn't be a problem. However, Scranton, in this world, rarely does an ideal system work. Humanity always screws something up, and that's what Resoku is talking about (i htink).
You're kind of on the right track. DADT isn't too flawed in itself, just the abuse of the rule and the human aspect is where the issue lies.

Those homophobes, their opinion and outlook towards gays isn't exactly a positive one. They're picking on and bashing other people because they aren't like most people.

@scrantoncity Oh, that's a good argument. Not. How about saying I'll avoid the topic all together? Like I suggested? Just laugh...

Also, I guess, just one more question. By bringing it up, the other guys in the situational conversation, aren't they breaking DADT? They're prompting a response from the gay guy, requiring him to come up with some bs about how he's straight, or come out and say he's gay.

It's don't ask don't tell right?

@piratedicecream Also, I guess, just one more question. By bringing it up, the other guys in the situational conversation, aren't...

No, they're not, are they? It's like you said, one way or the other they will talk about that eventually. It's up to the gay guy to come up with someone to pass it off. Anything; it's not that hard.

Then why get rid of the system if the only flaws are humankind? Why not crack down on unwarranted abuse or expulsion?

That's kinda like throwing out your refrigerator because your milk expired. There's no need to do anything except correct the milk's behavior. (Haha jk)

@scrantoncity No, they're not, are they? It's like you said, one way or the other they will talk about that eventually. It's up...

haha nice. But yeah, they are breaking it by bringing it up. Yes, it's going to happen, but that doesn't mean that because they're just going to talk about it eventually, it's okay for them to talk about it.

According to DADT, it's just as wrong to ask about it as it is to tell about it.

I've an answer to that! (roll with me here for a little) Communism, systematically, should everyone play their role correctly, is not a bad form a government. It would end hunger and poverty. But, humanity screws it up. ALWAYS. The one in power, the one that's supposed to be allocating resources etc to others will become corrupt. It's that corrupt form of communism that doesn't work.

The DADT is simlarly corrupt. People are allowed to ask (through bringing it up) but not allowed to tell. Don't ask if a guy is gay, he's not going to randomly spurt it out; he knows the consequences.

They SHOULD indeed crack down on unwarranted abuse, I never said do away with it bud, but

@scrantoncity No, they're not, are they? It's like you said, one way or the other they will talk about that eventually. It's up...

(cont.) but it would just be easier (imo) to get rid of the system than to isolate and correct those who abuse the system, which is many, but not all.

If they can fix that, and correct those abusing it, that's perfectly fine. The system is flawed, as we both have agreed.

If they do away with the system, then check it out, two problems are solved. People aren't being expelled for just being gay (I mean, if they break another rule, then yeah go for it), and the bashers, the ones who abuse the rule will also be taken care of. The bashing of another person is not tolerated in our military, so often times they use the DADT as a form of gay bashing "Oh you're gay? Since I can't beat the shit outta you, I'll get you kicked out" etc. Without DADT they can't bully them at all.

I'm not arguing for or against DADT with you, you and I both know your beliefs are near impossible to change. I'm simply saying people shouldn't bully another person for any reason at all. I...

@piratedicecream (cont.) but it would just be easier (imo) to get rid of the system than to isolate and correct those who abuse the...

Woah that was a long novel.

Yeah I kinda see your point, though I still think it's a necessary evil. There really is no need for anyone besides himself to know his sexuality.

Communism is indeed a very valid theory on paper, as (wait for it) is Big Bang! See how I can bring everything back to evolution/abiogenesis/start of universe? Pretty Legit. I'm done here. You made some good points, I still hold to my beliefs, we leave. Respect and order that's how it's done.

@scrantoncity As far as I know, there is no way to determine someone's opinion without outright asking them. It's really not that...

Does not knowing that the soldier next to you is gay change the fact that he IS? No. So, frankly, if he wants to let people know he is gay that should be his choice.

What's Westboro Church?

@shannonnn LOOK IT UP.

I kinda forgot I had the ability to do that. :P

@ItsBritniBetch What's Westboro Church?

Google it, it's basically a group of dumbass Christians who go to soldoers funerals and protest gays in the military.

Mikes avatar Mike Yeah You Are 0Reply
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