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Anyone who's an atheist just hasn't heard of Pascal's Wager, amirite?

12%Yeah You Are88%No Way
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I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god
I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me to hell

I instead decide to believe in all religions
The real god is pissed that I didn't only believe in him
I burn in hell

I wager to believe in the Christian god
I'm right
He can read my thoughts and knows I only did it to try to avoid hell
I burn until the end of time

Suzywaos avatar Suzywao No Way +78Reply
@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

I could say the same thing. You do not understand Islam and you will go to Hell unless you reject Christ and accept Allah.

You were damaged by the media forcing images of Islamic terrorism upon you from a young age, and brainwashed to believe in Christ by your parents, which repelled you from The True Lord. Maybe you should see a therapist so you can become less deluded.

You won't believe that, so why should I believe you?

Suzywaos avatar Suzywao No Way +55Reply
@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

Maybe you should reread my comment. There are thousands of gods and religions to choose from, and many would deny me on principal, knowing that I did not have faith, but was merely acting that way so as to get into heaven. You misunderstand atheists, many WANT to believe but simply cannot; it is not a conscious choice.

Suzywaos avatar Suzywao No Way +40Reply
@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

You lost me at "let's say the only three religions are Christianity, Judaism and Islam".

@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

As I said, you do not understand atheism.

I was raised to believe in God, but never could or did, even when I was very young. I went to church for most of my life. I never suddenly 'felt the light,' and I was certainly no rebellious teenager when I mentioned to my father I didn't believe as a small child.

Suzywaos avatar Suzywao No Way +35Reply
@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

"Saving a soul frometernal damnation"? All you're doing is arguing poorly and stating personal beliefs as facts, along with blatantly fabricating statistics.

Anonymous +24Reply
@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

Dude, you're never, ever going to "save a soul from eternal damnation" over the Internet, and especially not with your poor debating skills.

@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

rrw: Agnostics belive there isn't a way of knowing whether there is a god or not. Some don't believe in god but they accept that there is a possibility one exists, and some believe in god but accept that there may be nothing.

@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

Alright, take it easy. As insulting as Zap is being, he is either trolling or he doesn't realize it. And anyway, I do respect Christians for prosthelytizing, I think it's hypocritical if they don't.

That being said, Zapfino, what you fail to realize is that my chances of getting into heaven with the god that you believe in are 0%, unless you believe in a kinder less severe version of the Christian god, which I doubt. God would know my intent. He would KNOW that I was only 'believing' in him, or pretending to, to get into heaven. It would be an incredibly selfish rationale, and a sad imitation of true faith.

Try to believe in Allah. Now Zeus. Now nothing. Can you do it?

I can't either. That's why Pascal's Wager is not a conversion tool. You cannot choose to believe, and change your mind about these matters so flippantly. People need evidence and logic. You should refine your arguments if you want to convert and save souls.

Suzywaos avatar Suzywao No Way +16Reply
@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

Zapfino, if you're commenting on a post you should be ready for other people to see what you said and reply to it.

I think most people do understand your point, that if they believe in something there's a higher probability of being "correct" in the afterlife. But belief isn't something you can turn on and off. Personally I believe that there is something after we die, but it's not like I can just choose to believe Jesus was really a human incarnation of God, or that Brahma is real, or that no god exists.

@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

Gee, thanks! Before, I use to be an intelligent human, but then I welcomed an imaginary friend into my life thanks to an Internet stranger!

Sounds pretty dumb.

@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

"Okay other people please stop commenting because this is getting sidetracked. I'm trying to save a soul from eternal damnation."

At that point, I knew. There was a TROOOOOOOOOOLL!!! IN THE DUNGEON!!

@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

Well I used to be an atheist until I read this post. Now my soul is pure and free. thank you Zapfino. (:

Equals avatar Equal Yeah You Are +9Reply
@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

And to answer the people talking about agnosticism, @ilovewednesdays I don't myself 'want' to believe in god, but some do, if that was directed at me.

Agnosticism simply means that you think that you cannot prove the existence of god one way or another. It is not a statement of belief, but of knowledge. From there, you can be an agnostic atheist, or an agnostic theist. You could also be a gnostic atheist or theist.

If anyone is confused, this might help.

http://freethinker.co.uk/2009/09/25/8419/

@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

In response to the second comment (op), it doesn't work like that. Why not just believe in God? Asking an atheist that is like if I asked you "why not just believe in Santa?" It just isn't an option for us unless something changes (new evidence). I've tried convincing myself that God is real before, and I just couldn't. That's not how it works.

@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

For some reason people think classic is a bad thing. The emotional maturity of the OP is here holds hand way down low near waist and everyone arguing anonymously over the Internet to change OP's view and/or express their own has a maturity level of here holds hand down near ankles.

@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

Well you shouldn't only believe in God just to avoid going to hell. Do it because it's the right thing to do.

Equals avatar Equal Yeah You Are -4Reply
@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

Arguing over the Internet is like winning in the special Olympics. Even if you win, you're still a retard.

@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

Not with that attitude I won't if this post made one atheist reconsider their mutiny from The Lord then it's worth it guitarplayer213

Zapfinos avatar Zapfino Yeah You Are -12Reply
@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

I thought most atheists just simply don't believe do to the whole religion thing being stupid.

Since you want to believe doesn't that make you more agnostic?

@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

Okay other people please stop commenting because this is getting sidetracked. I'm trying to save a soul from eternal damnation.

You're not understanding, it's all probability. If you're atheist there is 0% you are going to an afterlife. Zip. Nada. You could say oh buddhism etc and other that don't require faith, but if you're accepted into those afterlives you'd be accepted if you were christian anyway. Even if you pick the God from Judaism or Islam you still have more of a chance at redemption.

I don't think people from Islam are terrorists and my parents are pretty relaxed with our religion.

Zapfinos avatar Zapfino Yeah You Are -24Reply
@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

Okay whatever but like look at it this way, let's say the only three religions are Christianity, Judaism and Islam

Atheist:
correct (christian) god sends you to hell, you burn no matter what OR there's nothing or something

Christian:
1 in 4 chance (really 100% but whatever) of god sending you to heaven, 1/2 chance of going to hell, 1/4 chance of nothing

Why would you not just believe in God

Zapfinos avatar Zapfino Yeah You Are -45Reply
@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

Okay I don't think you understand Christianity. You're gonna go to hell unless I save you. Really, it's not that hard to put your doubts aside and invest faith in something.

I believe you're a damaged soul who was traumatized by the overbearing force your parents had on you by bringing you to Church so much, which repelled you from The Lord. It's like with Sports, you should naturally love exercise but you'll hate it if your parents force you to go. Maybe you should see a therapist who can help you become less cynical?

Zapfinos avatar Zapfino Yeah You Are -53Reply
@Suzywao I wager on the existence of the Abrahamic god I pick the wrong version of him, and the correct version sends me...

Okay but lots of atheists don't go to church right? If you went to church you could let light into your heart and Jesus would save you. You'll believe eventually. I think most atheists are really really stupid for not just doing this.

I think most atheists are just rebellious teenagers tbh... :/

Zapfinos avatar Zapfino Yeah You Are -65Reply

“Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.”
― Marcus Aurelius

@yay_im_wrong “Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but...

You can. You also cannot. It's something you seem to not understand. You can live a good life with or without believing gods.

@yay_im_wrong “Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but...

Because

a) If we don't believe in god, then it wouldn't increase the likelihood at all.

b) Shouldn't "god" want all good people to go to heaven, not just "believers"?

@yay_im_wrong “Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but...

But why would heaven be as you envision it? And why believe in the Christian god? Why not my own god?

@yay_im_wrong “Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but...

So now the identity of the creator of the universe is based on how many people believe.
Before the beginning of mankind, there was a big bang that created the universe and Earth. Then during the Greek and Roman empire, the Earth was a sentient being who just appeared out of nowhere, created and then fucked the sky, and gave birth to a bunch of giant titans. Then after the end of the Roman empire, the universe was created in 6 days exactly the way it is now.
Sorry, but that's not the way it works. The universe was created once, and nobody knows who did it or why because nobody was there.

@yay_im_wrong “Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but...

The majority of people believing in something ≠ real
Also, the majority of people do not believe in the Christian God.
About 2.1 billion people are Christians. That means there are still about 5 billion people who do not believe in the Christian God, and I highly doubt all of those 5 billion people are "LOL I'M SO EDGY XD" teenagers.

Anonymous +5Reply
@yay_im_wrong “Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but...

But wouldn't heaven be better with /good/ people, not just people who worshipped Jesus/Allah/Yahweh/FSM?

@yay_im_wrong “Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but...

@Yay_Im_wrong

Agreed. The whole idea/theory of 'Heaven' is that it's a perfect place where people who have lived selflessly and morally go when they die. It's like a reward for not being an arsehole to humanity.

Beliefs do not necessarily make you moral, selfless or not an arsehole. If I believe that you should do good things, but I don't actually do any good things, it doesn't make me a good person. In this case, it's not the thought that counts, it's the action.

Believing in a certain religion does not make you automatically a good person worthy of going to 'Heaven'. It's the actions you take because you're following the rules of your religion that make you the good person. And if you are not religious but take the same actions as the 'good religious person' then you're also a good person worthy of going to 'Heaven', because your actions are the same even if they have been caused by different thoughts.

Say the most evillest person ever to have lived, pure evil, believed in Religion X and their Heaven. Say they killed millions and millions of innocent civilians, for no reason, as slowly and as painfully as possible. Do they get to go to Heaven? Do they deserve to?

@yay_im_wrong “Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but...

Ok I'm not lumping myself with this zapfino guy, but I was just trying to say that God couldn't let good people into heaven just because they're good, he wants ALL people in heaven, but if he let people who haven't asked for forgiveness in then it wouldn't be heaven...it would be earth

Anonymous -1Reply
@yay_im_wrong “Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but...

Ok everyone against Christianity seems to think he just weighs his options when you die and decides to let you into heaven, it doesn't work that way, as a perfect God he literally cannot be near sin and if you have sinned at all in your life then, even if he wanted to, he couldn't let you into heaven because you never asked for forgiveness, the choice is totally yours

Anonymous -3Reply
@yay_im_wrong “Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but...

A) Okay, but he may or may not be omnipotent. If you find it in your heart to believe you are increasing your odds of getting into heaven.

B) who care's what god wants this is about getting what you want

Zapfinos avatar Zapfino Yeah You Are -9Reply
@yay_im_wrong “Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but...

Why isn't anyone saying anything about how believing in a God increases your chances of redemption? That's a mathematical FACT

Zapfinos avatar Zapfino Yeah You Are -11Reply
@yay_im_wrong “Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but...

Who is your god? If a bunch of people don't believe in yours it's probably wrong anyway. The Christian god is right because everyone knows and believes in it except for a few LOL I'M SO EDGY XD teenagers.

The Bible says that Heaven's a pretty chill place so I'm just going that that.

Zapfinos avatar Zapfino Yeah You Are -13Reply

You want people to follow a religion, not because they believe in it nor because it will endow them with a sense of morals but because it is in their selfish interests to believe in one? Doesn't that completely go against the entire point of religion.

@Saigot You want people to follow a religion, not because they believe in it nor because it will endow them with a sense of...

Let's say there is a god, and he, as you say, has the power to decide whether, after a person dies, they get to live happily in heaven or get banished to an eternity of excruciating suffering. If he would decide to send me to hell solely because I don't believe in him, even though I lived a life relatively free of sin filled with helping the less fortunate, then he's just a total dick and I rebuke him for it.

Trogdors avatar Trogdor No Way +29Reply
@Saigot You want people to follow a religion, not because they believe in it nor because it will endow them with a sense of...

Wait, this isn't infidels.com?

And you got me, my lack of belief is a direct result of me failing my middle school algebra class. I admit it.

Trogdors avatar Trogdor No Way +18Reply
@Saigot You want people to follow a religion, not because they believe in it nor because it will endow them with a sense of...

Heathens? Seriously? You attempt to argue rationally and then insult anybody who doesn't belong to your religion by calling them names? Grow the fuck up.
Moreover, I completely agree with Saigon- If there is a god and judges based on faith alone, I don't want in. Think of it this way- If I live a life that adheres to the given religious moral code in every aspect except belief in that religion's deity and don't get into heaven, that means that not believing in that god is equal to or worse than the most grevious sin possible.

Anonymous +10Reply
@Saigot You want people to follow a religion, not because they believe in it nor because it will endow them with a sense of...

Pretending to believe in God obviously isn't enough to get someone to adopt the belief system and become a true follower of that religion, just look at the pedophile priests or the extremists or the huge history of people who do horrible things in the name of their god.
It isn't to the advantage to the individual as it means that they have no real faith they are simply hedging their bets, as God is omnipotent then IF he judges people based on their belief then someone who believes only because of Pascal's Wager will go to hell for they do not truly believe in God and as Trogdor pointing out many would rather rot in hell than follow such an unloving god as that, myself included.

@Saigot You want people to follow a religion, not because they believe in it nor because it will endow them with a sense of...

It's the principle of the thing. I, for one, have no desire to lower myself to the point where I say, "I hold these beliefs only because I'm frightened, not because I truly believe."

Not only would this be an insult upon my character, but I feel like it would be an indirect insult upon those who are religious. Imagine someone who has devoted their life and their faith to religion in comparison to someone who pretends to believe in God just because they want the perks that come with it. Wouldn't that anger you?

Anonymous +5Reply
@Saigot You want people to follow a religion, not because they believe in it nor because it will endow them with a sense of...

Okay but you can't make fun of me for insulting other people and then put all of those mean words in your paragraph that's not very nice

And you would really rather be tortured 5ever than live in relative closeness to an omnipotent douchebag? Wow are you a masochist or something?

Zapfinos avatar Zapfino Yeah You Are -10Reply
@Saigot You want people to follow a religion, not because they believe in it nor because it will endow them with a sense of...

@Trogdor, what do you mean 'let's say'? Why are there so many heathens on this site?

Well maybe he isn't omnipotent I mean he probably is but it's still just increasing your odds isn't it? What did you fail math or something?

And I would think that living with a douchebag would be better than suffering and being burned alive for an eternity. I mean it's like living with your sister or something versus lighting yourself on fire. Yeah both suck but you'd probably go for the first option unless you and your wife were into that.

Zapfinos avatar Zapfino Yeah You Are -13Reply
@Saigot You want people to follow a religion, not because they believe in it nor because it will endow them with a sense of...

I mean I'm sure while they're pretending along the way they'll probably find themselves believing in it. Jesus will pour light into your life if you let him.

Anyway it doesn't matter what I want it's just a good option, don't you think? Why wouldn't you do it even if it's selfishly?

Zapfinos avatar Zapfino Yeah You Are -23Reply

If there is a God, and Christians are right when they say He has plans for each one of us, wouldn't that mean that Atheism has to be a part of those plans? If he made everyone with a plan, and that plan is unwavering like people claim, doesn't that mean that He would have had to put Atheism into some people's plans, otherwise it wouldn't be here?

@tdubb If there is a God, and Christians are right when they say He has plans for each one of us, wouldn't that mean that...

God has a plan for all of us but he is also kind enough to allow us to stray from that plan and follow it on our own accord with the gift of Free Will. Some people never finish experimenting though because having Free Will makes it easy for Satan to get out and also no you're wrong

Zapfinos avatar Zapfino Yeah You Are -5Reply

Do people seriously believe that everyone following a religion even slightly different from the correct one (or no religion at all) will automatically go to Hell?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheist%27s_Wager

@personThingy Do people seriously believe that everyone following a religion even slightly different from the correct one (or no...

My history teacher junior year was Jewish.

One day he told us about his grandmother's inability to escape Germany before being caught by the Nazi's. She pretty much sacrificed herself to get her daughter (my teacher's mother) out of the country.

Then a kid in my class raised his hand and told the teacher he was going to Hell for not believing in Jesus.

@personThingy Do people seriously believe that everyone following a religion even slightly different from the correct one (or no...

I hate people like that. Christians are supposed to be accepting and tolerant and they make us look bad. They're supposed to show how loving our god is and make people want to be saved, but not shove it down anyone's throat or tell them they're going to hell.

@personThingy Do people seriously believe that everyone following a religion even slightly different from the correct one (or no...

No, I think that Atheist Wager does a much better job at defending atheism than Pascal's wager does at attacking it.
Denying faith might be a bold move, but pretending to believe in an omnipotent God is even worse. I believe He will reward you more for not worshiping Him than for worshiping Him just to get into Heaven. I worship God because I believe He exists. Pascal worshiped God because he thought he might go to Hell if he didn't.

This is bloody hilarious.

Runys avatar Runy No Way +8Reply
@Runy This is bloody hilarious.

Not when you're dealing with the most unreligious religious person ever. Then it's hilarious.

@Runy This is bloody hilarious.

I'm very religious omg!!

Zapfinos avatar Zapfino Yeah You Are -1Reply
@Runy This is bloody hilarious.

It's not. This is serious.

Zapfinos avatar Zapfino Yeah You Are -4Reply

I commend your trolling sir

Anonymous +8Reply

Guys, I think we've fed the troll enough.

That's why I believe in the Flying Spaghetti Monster

Anonymous +7Reply

Honestly, believing in a god does NOT increase your chances of redemption, because your chance of redemption with believing a god gives 0/infinity chance of redemption, while believing gives you a 1/infinity chance, and anything over infinity is theoretically zero.

They just don't make them this retarded anymore

Anonymous +4Reply

@op

How about you let people believe what they want to believe, and stop shoving your religon down everybody's throats. Quite frankly, no one cares, and you're not convincing anyone.

@Parrocchetto @op How about you let people believe what they want to believe, and stop shoving your religon down everybody's...

@zapfino

Then the vast majority of people don't care. If they did then this post would have been positive. Look, I'm an atheist and when people post stuff like this, it doesn't convice me that there's a God. Instead, it frustrates me. Most atheists have heard the same exact arguments that you have provided, and hearing it for the 10,000th time isn't going to make them "see the light". I can tell that you are religious, and you don't see me trying to change that because I don't care if you believe in God or not.  That's your personal decision. This wasn't intended to be rude, and I apologize if it came off that way, but I'm just tying to say that you're getting on everybody's nerves, and it's not really helping your case. 

@Parrocchetto @op How about you let people believe what they want to believe, and stop shoving your religon down everybody's...

I'm sure someone cares it's the little things that count you don't understand not everyone is vocal and if this post helped any poor wandering soul who has turned his back from the Lord it's worth it

you don't have to be so rude :(

Zapfinos avatar Zapfino Yeah You Are -8Reply

Religion is just a tad to negative for me.

Those who stick by their beliefs have dignity.

Those who shove their beliefs in a corner, put on a fake smile and pretend to believe something else just for the (after)life insurance have none.

Anonymous +4Reply

Pascal's Wager is an outrageously stupid reason to "believe", but that's not even the point of your post. The fact that so many atheists (myself included) have heard Pascal's Wager and have apparently not changed their beliefs proves you totally wrong. In fact, you'd be hard-pressed to find a single former-atheist whose beliefs shifted 'just in case'.

Anyone who's religious just hasn't heard of the Atheist's Wager, amirite?

Anonymous +3Reply

Yes. Totally.
[/sarcasm]

@PurpleZebra Yes. Totally. [/sarcasm]

It's </sarcasm>, not [/sarcasm]. Just saying.

@PurpleZebra Yes. Totally. [/sarcasm]

what does [/sarcasm] mean??

Zapfinos avatar Zapfino Yeah You Are -7Reply
This comment was deleted by its author.
@1752182

Atheist to atheist, that may have been the most retarded thing I've read on this site. You think 'aha funny saying most retarded ever for dramatic effect' but no. You are the reason people think we are arrogant ignorant assholes, and you are also an example of the 'edgy fake teenage' atheist OP mentioned. Your beliefs are right, but you yourself are one big fuck up of ideals.

Anonymous +2Reply
@1752182

Wow... Ok I'm sorry.

Madies avatar Madie No Way 0Reply

I feel like this is a failed troll since 1) most people had civil conversations in the comments, and 2) reading the comments is actually pretty informative, and I ended up getting a lot out of it. HOWEVER, I COMMEND YOUR EFFORTS, GOOD SIR.

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