+144 The freedom of speech comes with the freedom of consequence. amirite?

by Anonymous 1 year ago

I am happy to let you call me any name you want as long as I am afforded the same courtesy, but if you argue that violence or a concerted conspiracy to ruin someones life is an appropriate response to speech people find disagreeable or objectionable, which is how this argument is often framed, then I fundamentally disagree.

by Anonymous 1 year ago

Most forms of violence are not permitted by law in every western country and many more. What I am talking about is those provocating, and then being surprised by a civil counter protest.

by Anonymous 1 year ago

This actually isn't an unpopular opinion-- it's quite popular. I think the problem I have here is phrasing. Typically people say *"Freedom of speech does* ***not*** *mean freedom from consequences."* And it's usually referring to situations like someone saying something reprehensible (racist, homophobic, misogynistic, harassment, etc.) and then getting angry when they face consequences like losing their job or social circles.

by Anonymous 1 year ago

Freedom of speech applies to the GOVERNMENT. The government can't punish you, silence you, or campaign against you for expressing your opinions of it even if those opinions are very bad. It doesn't apply to private entities. You're free to express your opinion and they are free to express their opinion of you. They're not allowed to harm you but expecting no talkback is silly. When you put your opinion out there, you are inviting a discussion and other opinions.

by Anonymous 1 year ago

The 1st Amendment applies to the government. Freedom of speech is a societal ideal that is enshrined in the 1st Amendment.

by Anonymous 1 year ago

It's also a societal ideal to not do things that unreasonably interfere with others, to be nice, and to also talk if spoken to/about. 1A is not about a societal ideal. It's about allowing people to criticize the government in order to avoid tyranny. It was never intended to allow people to say whatever they want to their neighbors. In fact, there used to be a defense to a battery charge if a person struck another after hearing "fighting words." These included stuff like insulting a person's competency at their profession or accusing their wife of indecent behavior.

by Anonymous 1 year ago

Sure, you're welcome to disagree with me. But if you hate me for my opinion, then that's you being the A------, not me. I don't hate.

by Anonymous 1 year ago

Do you know what freedom of speech means?? Freedom of speech protects Americans from retaliation from the government if they speak out against it. Freedom of speech doesn't mean you can just say whatever you want because you can't. For example, hate speech doesn't get covered under freedom of speech. If you were to criticize the president or whatever, you're not going to jail or getting punished because of freedom of speech. If you threaten someone with harm, you'll be punished. Also, freedom of speech is somewhat restricted in schools. You have a misunderstanding of what freedom of speech is

by Anonymous 1 year ago

You must not be American. In which case you don't have freedom of speech. Its strange how people find this confusing. You do have freedom of speech in USA. There are specific instances where that doesn't apply but those are obvious because they violate other laws. Like liable and slander and threats of violence. These transcend freedom of speech into actual violations of law. Other then that you do have complete freedom of speech, which only applies to government retaliation, a private business can do what they want. Also there is no such thing as hate speech in USA. You are free to zeig heil all day long.

by Anonymous 1 year ago

Tell that to 99% of "the right" ..

by Anonymous 1 year ago

Mate getting thrown in prison for saying something isn't the same as this. That's what happens to us (UK). That's the consequences we complain about.

by Anonymous 1 year ago

I'm also in the UK and i'm intruiged about who's been thrown in prison for "saying something" ?

by Anonymous 1 year ago

unless its from the government. the whole point is government is not allowed to punish you for speech.

by Anonymous 1 year ago

What happens when the banks freeze your accounts (not the government) and the corporations decide to completely blacklist you permanently (not the government)? Who decides who can punish who? Where is the line drawn?

by Anonymous 1 year ago

Define "consequences." That's where this thing usually goes wrong.

by Anonymous 1 year ago

Counter protest

by Anonymous 1 year ago

Speech isn't free. The cost is always the consequence. In the US, the government (with many exceptions) can't make any laws restricting a citizen's speech. That's not "free speech."

by Anonymous 1 year ago

That's not unpopular

by Anonymous 1 year ago

Freedom of speech means you can speak out against institutions, specifically governmental, without fear of reprisal. It has nothing to do with threats, libel, or vocal organization for committing a crime. Hate speech does not count as free speech if it involves threatening a non governmental individual, in any way, physical, or otherwise.

by Anonymous 1 year ago

Not unpopular. Freedom of speech is not a freedom to advocate hate/harm/eugenics/homophobia etc.

by Anonymous 1 year ago

Your right to free speech ends where it infringes upon someone else's rights or incites harm. It's important to strike a balance.

by Anonymous 1 year ago

There are also freedom of consequences to your reactionary consequences to the freedom of speech, keep that in mind.

by Anonymous 1 year ago

I own the moon The consequence is get off my planet 😾

by Anonymous 1 year ago

You're right that you're allowed to critique people, that's fine. But a few things: 1) cancelling people, although legally fine in some cases, is not in the "spirit" of freedom of speech, in that you are eventually coercing people to not say the opinions that you think, especially when this cancellation comes in the form of mobs, whether online or in person. You can not like or complain about what people have to say but to say "they shouldn't say it or else…" is not in the spirit of free speech. As a democracy our people should uphold this as much as they can. 2) hate speech laws don't count for this. This is like saying "North Korea actually does have freedom of speech, just that if you say something bad about the government you get imprisoned because freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom from consequences".

by Anonymous 1 year ago